Planet ISKCON

By Vijaya Das

March was a great month for book distribution. Four hundred and seventy-nine thousand nine hundred and two books were distributed to the people on this planet, giving them the opportunity to connect with Krsna, stop their suffering, and begin their journey back to Godhead. The most important moment in a person's life is when they get one of Prabhupada's books, hear the holy name, or take krsna-prasada. Continue reading "WSN May 2025 – World Sankirtan Newsletter
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On May 1, 1977, the day before the festival honoring the appearance of Lord Nrisimha, Srila Prabhupada’s dear disciple Jayananda Dasa passed from this world. 

Shortly thereafter, Srila Prabhupada wrote in a letter, “Jayananda’s death is glorious. . . . He has left his body very wonderfully, and he has been transferred to Vaikuntha. . . . Everyone should follow the example of Jayananda. I am very proud that I had such a nice disciple. If possible Jayananda’s picture should be hung in the ratha [festival chariot] of Lord Jagannatha, and in all of our temples a day may be set aside for holding a festival in his honor, just as we do on the disappearance day of the other great Vaisnavas.”

Jayananda Prabhu was one of Prabhupada’s first disciples in San Francisco, the site of ISKCON’s second temple. During his years of dedicated service to Srila Prabhupada, he inspired many, many people, devotees and non-devotees alike.

Jayananda was the all-American boy. Handsome, strong, intelligent, born in a more than middle-class family, Jayananda (Jim Kohr) took a degree in mechanical engineering from Ohio State University. With a background like that, it is surprising that Jayananda ended up as a cab driver in San Francisco. Karandhara once asked him why he didn’t get a better-paying job. “I didn’t fit in with the upper class crowd,” he said.

Always introspective in nature, Jayananda felt empty and unsatisfied within himself during his college years. He would often say that he was “never happy” before joining Krishna consciousness. His depression was almost suicidal when, in 1967, he read a small article in a San Francisco paper, about an Indian Swami who had come to the Bay Area to propagate the chanting of the names of God. Jayananda recalled feeling a “ray of hope” when he read that article. Thinking the Swami may have something to offer, Jayananda made up his mind to attend the Swami’s lectures. 

Srila Prabhupada’s early lectures in the Bay Area were mostly attended by hippies, and Jayananda was one of the only “straight” people there. Jayananda later recalled that, “I wasn’t much of a religionist, but I was attracted to Srila Prabhupada.” He was especially fond of attending the early morning lectures because at that hour, most of the hippies would be in bed. On some occasions Jayananda would be the only guest listening to Srila Prabhupada speak from the Bhagavatam.

Srila Prabhupada was always fond of Jayananda, and sometimes he would invite his budding disciple to take prasad with him in his room. “Srila Prabhupada would cook prasad and serve me,” Jayananda recalled. “He didn’t say anything – he just kept feeding me, and I kept eating.” Jayananda soon donated his life savings of $5,000 to Srila Prabhupada to help His Divine Grace print the Bhagavad-Gita As It Is. As more and more devotees joined ISKCON in the Bay Area, Jayananda continued to work as a cab driver and supported the Temple by contributing all of his earnings.

Jayananda knew how to attract people to Krishna consciousness with the prasadam weapon. When a new devotee came, for example, Jayananda would see to it that he was sumptuously fed with prasadam. When Jambavan Das was just becoming a devotee, Jayananda would bring him a plate of prasadam so big that he thought he could never eat it all. When he finally did finish the plate, Jayananda immediately put an identical plate down before him. “I can’t eat that,” said Jambavan. “Srila Prabhupada said that we should eat ’til we waddle like a duck,” said Jayananda. Jambavan would finish the second plate.

Another example of his attachment to Krishna consciousness is Jayananda’s love for kirtan (chanting). Jayananda was always eager to take the whole Temple out on hari-nama chanting parties. He had a special attraction for chanting in the streets. Whether kirtan was held in the temple or in the street, Jayananda could always be seen dancing and chanting enthusiastically.

Of all the processes of Krishna consciousness, Jayananda was most attached to preaching. Whether it was during the Sunday feast, while making incense runs, or while building Ratha-yatra carts, Jayananda was always trying to find some person with whom he could share his ecstasy in Krishna consciousness. His preaching was very simple and easy to listen to. “We just have to keep chanting and have faith in the Name.” “We just have to chant and take prasadam. Srila Prabhupada is so kind to give us such a simple process.”

Humility was certainly Jayananda’s most prominent quality. He treated everyone as his superior, even new devotees. He avoided praise like the plague. Devotees got to know that if they wanted to be around him, they’d better not praise Jayananda. Otherwise he would simply leave. He was very special, and yet no one paid any special attention to him. That was just the way he liked things.

Jayananda would use his personal charm with people to get them to give everything free or at a discount for Krishna. Without spending huge sums of money, he would personally collect nearly all the bhoga, flowers, lumber, paint, and everything else needed to put on Ratha-yatra each year.

Although he was a senior devotee and could have had anything he wanted, he always dressed in old dhotis and work clothes which he’d buy for one dollar per set at the Salvation Army thrift store.

Jayananda’s final meeting with Srila Prabhupada took place in New York City at the 1976 Ratha-yatra. When Prabhupada arrived at the airport, Jayananda drove the car to pick him up. Prabhupada was sitting in the back seat and he asked, “Who is driving?”

The devotees said, “This is Jayananda.” “Oh, I know Jayananda,” said Prabhupada. “He gave me $5,000 to print my Bhagavad-Gita.”

The ultimate expression of Jayananda’s fearlessness came at the end of his life when he was diagnosed with leukemia and cancer of the lymph glands. Even in his last few months in L.A. temple, Jayananda never succumbed to fear or self-pity.

The festival managers will readily admit that, without Jayananda’s presence, the first Ratha-yatra festival in L.A. would not have taken place in 1977. Thus he proved that by engaging in devotional service, one transcends even the fear of death.

The International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON) has established and maintained exceptional standards of deity worship across its global network of temples, creating a profound spiritual atmosphere for devotees and visitors alike. This commitment to excellence in deity worship represents one of the organization’s most distinctive features, embodying the vision of its founder, Srila Prabhupada,
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*Srimad Bhagavatam* Class by HH Bhakti Prabhava Swami(SB 1.13.8), focusing on the life and teachings of Mahātma Vidura. It discusses Vidura’s return after a long pilgrimage and his role in guiding his elder brother, Dhritarashtra. The lecture highlights Vidura’s wisdom, his impartiality, and how he protected the Pandavas from political intrigues within the royal family.
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So, I was trying to understand how in Lord Rama’s pastime, his Altha was to be a king, but he, his role was, I mean he was Lord himself, so his Parmartha also is like, it’s like kind of serving his own self, right? He’s the Lord. And in that context, I want to understand when Mother Sita was, when he told Lakshmana to meet Mother Sita in the ashram, when she was carrying the avankur. So, would you like to elaborate like in this context, like what was played out in his mind and it was, what was his priority, you know, in terms of his Altha and Parmartha? Would I like to elaborate? No.

Some pastimes are very difficult to understand and sometimes you cannot get, to get a satisfactory understanding of this. All that you can get is the least unsatisfactory understanding. So, I will share with you the understanding that I find least unsatisfactory.

I have written books on the Ramayana and I’m trying to write future also and this is, I have many scholars in the Ramayana, in our tradition, outside the tradition, I have talked with them, tried to read the traditional commentaries, whatever are available, but it is a very difficult pastime to go through all of it. So, we talked about it. The key point is that there is context.

Generally speaking, the principle is that if an action does not make sense, if I do good, if I am polite with you and you are rude with me, I can say that you are a terrible person or I’m a, I’m a worthless person. Or I can say maybe we have some history from behind, because of which this is happening. So, there are, that way, the world makes sense, but it doesn’t make sense in this context.

So, in the immediate context, there is no way you can make sense. If a man abandons his pregnant wife over an unproven allegation or rather an allegation that has been proven to be false, that man would not be considered even an ordinarily responsible person, what to speak of an ideal person. And if a civilization or a culture considers such a person to be ideal, that civilization should be condemned.

So, the point is that in the immediate context, there is no denying that it does not make any sense. So, if we consider only the dynamic of the husband-wife relationship, the context of the husband-wife relationship. So, then, so this is the immediate context, the husband and wife relationship.

So, in this context, it’s no sense at all. So, then sometimes we may have to put it in a bigger context. Lakshana Prabhupada says that sometimes in a family, the mother-in-law may chastise her own daughter to instruct her daughter.

So, that daughter may say, I am not doing anything wrong, but I am being chastised and she also understands, this is not meant for the daughter. So, like that, sometimes you speak one thing to one person, but somebody else is hearing. That thing is not meant for that person, that thing is meant for the other person.

But this person can become indignant. Why are you speaking this to me? I never did this. Understand, I have a purpose.

I’ll tell you later. It’s like that. So, in the context, it does not make any sense.

So, now we can broaden the context. So, there are four levels of broadening that are possible. The first level of broadening is that Lord Ram is a husband, but he’s also a king.

Now, he has a relationship with the healer. And in one sense, in that cultural context, for Lord Ram to be with his wife, who was suspected of something inappropriate, that would have reflected that he was attached to her. And he was excessively attached to her.

And because of that Rajdharma, he had to choose between Rajdharma and pati. And he chose the Rajdharma at that particular time. And that is a sacrifice.

It is. Now, if you see, so one context is Rajdharma, he has chosen as more important than the patidharma. So, it is clear that he is not rejecting her as a person.

And how do we know that? Three things. First is he does not remarry. He’s a king, he could easily remarry.

Now, he maintains her word to him. His word to him that I’ll be a king. Apart from that, not only does not he maintain his word to her, he also does not think it’s a royal duty.

When he has to perform yajna, the brahmanas say you need to have your wife with you. So, he actually creates a golden effigy of her. And he puts that golden effigy next to her.

So, now, which person do you even like? If you keep the photo of a person in your home, we keep the photo of people whom we love and respect. Now, if somebody has disgraced our family, sometimes some cultures are very reputation conscious or honor conscious. And if some person has disgraced that family, they will actually like deny the existence of that person.

They will not keep any photo in public. Even if there are albums, they will delete that person’s photo from there. Like erase that person’s existence.

Far from erasing her existence, Lord Ram actually makes an effigy of her and puts that in the yajna. Yajna is a place where he is putting that there itself is an indication that he has not rejected her. So, not only has he not rejected her, he does not even believe that accusation.

Because if he considers her impure for a pure activity like a yajna, he will not put her there. And even the brahmanas don’t object to it. So, it is not her purity that is being asked.

And the third thing is, and although the word banishment can be used, that he banished her, it’s not in the same sense in which Ram himself was banished. Because he sent her to Valmiki’s ashram. And Valmiki’s ashram was in Lord Ram’s yajna.

So, it is not that Valmiki’s ashram was being troubled by Rakshasas or being predators and she wasn’t physically there. So, in one sense, she was indirectly in his protection. So, now, what exactly about the Raja Dharma? This is where Indian culture, American culture are different.

The idea of a person renouncing his family for the sake of the larger good. That’s something in Indian culture it’s understood. The current Indian Prime Minister, he has a wife but he doesn’t, he has never spent much time with his wife.

He doesn’t have children. So, even Gandhiji was materially renounced. Some killers were not.

But in the Indian ethos, like giving up the family for the sake of a larger cause is something which is accepted, even respected. But I’ve seen in America, people just don’t understand this. Because America, they have a culture of the first lady.

That, you know, it’s like you cannot be the president unless you have a, every politician generally, especially top politicians, they have to go with their family. And often they will put, they’ll proudly say, although I am the president, my family comes first. And so that, that is a very different value system.

So, to some extent, the idea of Lord Ram sacrificing pati dharma for raja dharma, it’s understandable for Indians. For Americans, it becomes much more difficult to understand. But this, in the bigger context, now how would it have affected his being a king? It’s a very cultural, contextual thing.

So, at that particular time, there was a particular time when purity of women was considered extremely important. Anyone, even in Europe, in the European tradition, the Caesar’s wife should be above suspicion. So, that was, you could say, it’s an unfair standard of purity that is expected of a woman.

And especially in her case, she was not consenting at all. And all that is true. But every culture has its own ways of functioning.

Now, what is that in the first context? That the raja dharma is prioritized over the pati dharma. Having said this, none of the acharyas who have commented on the Ramayana, or even the tradition of the Ramayana, considers this as the behavior to be normalized and adopted by everyone. India has one of the strongest family structures.

In the West, families are falling apart. In India also, it’s happening, unfortunately. But it’s much lesser.

The family structure is very resilient. And no book has inspired the Indian mind as much as the Ramayana. So, if a core teaching of this book is that reject your wife over an unsubstantial allegation, then that culture would not have been so family-friendly, or family support would be so family-emphasizing.

So, within the tradition itself, from the story of the Ramayana, certain teachings are emphasized, certain teachings are not emphasized. And the Ramayana commentators of Sri Vaishnava tradition, they say that even Lakshman’s following Ram is not to be imitated. That Sita is going with Ram, then they are a family unit.

That is to be imitated. Lakshman’s following Ram is glorious because Ram is God. But Lakshman’s following Ram is actually unfair for Ramayana.

So, he’ll take her with him. So, even that is not to be imitated. So, that’s why one of the key principles in understanding a text is to see how the tradition that has emerged from the text understands the text.

So, this is certainly not something to be imitated. Now, the second context you could put it in is the context of previous life. Like I said, the Lord does not have a previous life and that is true.

But there is a story given in the Ramayana itself of a case where I won’t go into the full story, but Bhrigu Muni, his wife, I think her name is Kirti. So, there is a demon who has been chased by, who has been terrorizing the universe and that demon has been chased by, finally at a particular opportune time, Lord Vishnu borders him, is about to kill him. The demon flees and takes shelter in the ashram of Bhrigu Muni, where Khyati is there.

He says, please save me. And Khyati says, I will protect you. And Vishnu says, no, this is a terrible demon, I have to kill him.

Vishnu’s Khyati says, no, he has taken shelter of me, I am not going to kill him. Lord Vishnu says that this is a terrible demon. If we don’t kill him at this time, he will continue terrorizing and destroying the universe.

I have to kill him right now, this is the only time available. He says, no, I cannot let him, he has taken shelter of me. Then he says, for the sake of the universe, I have to kill you to kill him.

He says, whatever you do, I am not going to let you. Then Lord Vishnu kills Khyati and then he comes back. He is aghast.

Lord Vishnu says, this is what happened and I can revive Khyati right now for you. He says, how could you have killed a woman, you were meant to protect her. He says, just as you have caused me to suffer separation from my wife, I curse you, that you will suffer separation from your wife.

So, now the Lord is beyond all curses, but the Lord of Greece fully accepts that curse. So, that curse later comes back. So, when a curse from previous life acts, it may seem to have no rationale in this life.

So, that is another bigger context. So, Sita herself was blameless, but it was something from the previous life that was blamed. And the third is, so that is the context of the book itself and the mood of the book or the mood of the larger leela.

See, in general, the Ramayana’s mood is the mood of sacrifice. That, you see, Ram did not have to go on exile. Ram could have rebelled against his father and father.

But Ram did not do that. So, you know, Dasharatha is not a victimizer and Ram is not a victim. Both of them are caught in a circumstance.

Now, to some extent, we can understand this circumstance, but at least even now, the idea of honoring one’s word is something which people do respect. Although I have seen young people ask the question, just clearly, why did Ram even have to go to the forest? He said, you know, Dasharatha had given a word at a particular time. He said, this is blind obedience to somebody else’s word.

So, we could say that, we could question that also. But at least it’s understandable. Now, what happens is this is seen as noble, Ram’s nobility, Ram’s selflessness.

But Ram doesn’t become bitter towards Dasharatha and Dasharatha does not, is not angry with Ram. There is no fault on Ram’s side. So, that same spirit of sacrifice that Ram and Dasharatha, when Sita goes with Ram, Sita is giving up, Sita is giving up the kingdom, Lakshman is giving up the kingdom, that mood of sacrifice is the consistent theme of the Ramayana.

And finally, what Dasharatha does to Ram, Ram has to do to Sita. So, it is not that Ram is the victimizer and Sita is the victim. Just that Dasharatha is not the victimizer and Sita is not, Ram is not the victim.

Both Ram and Sita are caught in a circumstance. That circumstance is an unfortunate circumstance. And both of them have to participate in a sacrifice.

It’s a painful sacrifice. Just that Dasharatha does not celebrate when Ram goes away. Ram does not celebrate, oh this impure woman in my life, I got rid of her.

There is absolutely no celebration. And just as Ram is not bitter towards Dasharatha, Sita is heartbroken when Ram rejects her. Ram rejects also is a strong word, but Ram abandons her, whatever you want to say.

But she understands, she is heartbroken. At a level of emotion, she is completely shattered. But I understand why he has done this.

And the test that she accepts is that she does not poison her children’s mind about her. If there is a messy divorce in which, say one person feels that the other person has betrayed me, has manipulated me, has wronged me, and quite often the children are poisoned by it. So she does not do that.

So is she pained by it? Is she heartbroken by it? Definitely. But is she bitter? Is she vindictive? Not at all. So the mood of sacrifice, of putting a larger principle above one’s personal pleasure, that is the consistent mood of Ram.

This is Jata. You could have said that, why should I fight against Raavan? He is clearly younger than me, faster than me. Sita does not fight against him.

She is like, how can I just stand by and let him be abducted? Whatever it means by that, I have to try to fight it. So it is a sacrifice. The sacrifice can come in many different forms.

The broader principle of sacrifice is what has been discussed. So these three contexts, the context of a larger dharma, the context of the previous life, and the context of the purpose of the Leela, can help us make sense of that pastime to some extent. Still, the problem comes with twofold.

One is that this pastime is often seen through the feminist lens, that Ram is a man, and he is a male authority figure, and Sita is a woman, and she is victimized. Unfortunately, there have been many instances of patriarchal abuse of power, and then that all becomes very messy. But it does not have to be seen through that lens.

So when we see through that lens, then it becomes outrageous, unacceptable and outrageous. But that is not the lens that the Ramayan is seen through. That is not the lens in which the Ramayan tradition is encouraging us to So as I said, it has never become the norm in Indian society that a woman should be abandoned or rejected because of some unsuspecting actions.

So that is one problem. And the second is that quite often there are some traditions, some commentators who say that this pastime is interpolation. Now, even there are some scholars who go in that favor, and they say it’s interpolation by some people.

Now, no one would be happier than me if this were interpolation in one sense. It would be a big relief. But it’s difficult to make that argument because the traditional Uttarkhand, sometimes people say the whole Uttarkhand is interpolation.

But our prominent Acharyas have not spoken like that. In the Srivastava tradition, they have written commentaries on this. And there are songs about Sita’s agony, Ram’s agony.

So this is definitely an inconvenient part of our tradition. But then, convenience is not necessarily the way we learn about lessons of transcendence. So if somebody wants to take that interpolation argument, I mean, it’s up to them.

But generally in the tradition, that’s not what has been taken.

The post Why did Rama reject Sita? appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

This chapter of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam recounts the remarkable story of Narada Muni, tracing his spiritual evolution from a simple boy to a revered sage among the gods. Before he became known as Narada—the transcendental sage and eternal messenger of devotion—he lived a very different life. He was neither a sage nor a mystic, but rather
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Dr. Ravi M. Gupta, also known as Radhika Ramana Dasa in Vaishnava circles, represents a remarkable synthesis of rigorous academic scholarship and deep spiritual devotion. As the Charles Redd Endowed Chair of Religious Studies and Director of the Religious Studies Program at Utah State University, Dr. Gupta has established himself as one of the foremost
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Dr. Ravi M. Gupta, also known as Radhika Ramana Dasa in Vaishnava circles, represents a remarkable synthesis of rigorous academic scholarship and deep spiritual devotion. As the Charles Redd Endowed Chair of Religious Studies and Director of the Religious Studies Program at Utah State University, Dr. Gupta has established himself as one of the foremost
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The post Gita for CEO 3 – Finding meaning in our work – Chaitanya Charan appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

The post Gita for CEO 2 – Why don’t people listen to me – Chaitanya Charan appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

The post Gita for CEO 1 – Leadership by disposition vs by position – Chaitanya Charan appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

Why does Krishna describe about Ashtanga Yoga in 5.27 and 28?

Three broad understandings can be there. Krishna has given the stage of perfection in the preceding verses, especially 5.25 and 26 and he is giving alternative pathways to that perfection.

After he has talked about Karma Yoga practice leading to that perfection and thus he talks about Dhyana Yoga which he will be elaborating in the 6th chapter and Bhakti Yoga which he will be elaborating in chapter 7 to 12 and which he points to in 5.29. Of course, because Krishna himself does not explicitly give any clear indications of the reason for that particular thought flow, we can only look at the context as well as the commentaries and try to figure out what is happening and see whether whatever insights we get actually make sense to us. The other point is that Krishna is focusing on the principle that the realization that is got about Brahman because he has largely used the word Brahma and not used any reference to himself till now in the 5th chapter. So, that understanding can be further deepened and evolved through the practice of Dhyana Yoga which will culminate in Bhakti Yoga and which will help a person understand that the highest realization of spiritual reality is to see not Brahman but Krishna and it is that which will give a person the ultimate unadulterated peace which is what is lacking in Arjuna’s life and which is what has led to the breakdown which led him to inquire about the Bhagavad Gita and that flow towards a deeper realization of the ultimate reality will happen in the next chapter which culminates in 6.47 with even the yogis getting the realization that the highest reality is Krishna himself.

So whereas the first analysis focuses on the progression of the paths with the future descriptions being given a preview here, the second explanation focuses on the progression of the sadhya of the understanding of the ultimate reality and this does not require the notion of a preview but this is just a progression and how to progress toward that higher realization will be described in the subsequent chapters.

The post Why does Krishna describe about Ashtanga Yoga in 5.27 and 28? appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

Whereas the GBC Executive Committee requested the GBC Organizational Development Committee to propose improved functioning of the GBC, which includes meetings Therefore, it is resolved that: The GBC body endorses the following steps to improve their AGM meeting. These should be achieved by the Executive Committee engaging the guidance of experienced and trained facilitators and
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The final day of the Gopal Krishna Goswami 13 Day Matching fundraiser is Nrsimha Caturdasi (May 10 U.S. | May 11 India). This is the last opportunity to have your donation for TOVP construction matched by Ambarisa prabhu during this marathon fundraiser. Sponsor a Gopal Krishna Goswami medallion or give a donation of any amount according to your means to support this landmark project of Srila Prabhupada.

Go to the Matching Fundraiser webpage today or use the QR codes below!

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A recent interview sheds light on a significant leadership transition in the ISKCON (International Society for Krishna Consciousness) community in the DACHL region—comprising Germany (D), Austria (A), Switzerland (CH), and Liechtenstein (L). In a conversation with Mother Dina Sharana Devi Dasi and Krishna Premarupa Dasa, both prominent figures within ISKCON, the implications, intentions, and emotions
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307.09: ISKCON — other: The sacred birthplace of Bhaktivinoda Thakura [Title] – Honoring the sacred birthplace of Bhaktivinoda Thakura — 2025 [Meeting] – Annual General Meeting [Category] – Statement [Date passed] – February 23, 2025 Whereas Birnagar is the birthplace of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, and it holds significant historical and spiritual importance for devotees; Whereas
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307.09: ISKCON — other: The sacred birthplace of Bhaktivinoda Thakura [Title] – Honoring the sacred birthplace of Bhaktivinoda Thakura — 2025 [Meeting] – Annual General Meeting [Category] – Statement [Date passed] – February 23, 2025 Whereas Birnagar is the birthplace of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, and it holds significant historical and spiritual importance for devotees; Whereas
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Sita devi was not born of a woman but of the Earth Goddess, Bhumi devi herself. In Maharishi Valmiki’s own words, Ramayana is known as the noble story of Sita — “Sita-ayah Charitam Mahat”. 

Janaka Maharaj, the king of Mithila, was ploughing a piece of land to prepare it for conducting a yajna. While ploughing, he unearthed a golden casket in which he found a beautiful girl, which caused him to be greatly overjoyed. Because land ploughed by the yoke is called ‘sita’, he named the baby Sita. 

With her arrival, the king’s good fortune improved greatly, and his queen gave birth to a daughter named Urmila. The royal couple brought up their children with great affection, giving them good education and all facility. The two beautiful girls, displaying all noble qualities and intelligence, endeared themselves to all and grew to become ideal princesses. 

Sita devi was to be given in marriage to anyone who could bend the powerful bow given to Janaka by Lord Shiva. Lord Rama succeeded in bending the great bow, and he married Sita. Their later, inconceivable pastimes are presented throughout Sri Ramayana.

Thank you for a wonderful class. What comes to mind when you’re reading things of this stature is that it’s so phantasmagoria, practically. I mean, it’s like a movie or something.

How do you get the living energy to understand these principles of freedom, like Krishna Consciousness, when you have to read these kind of descriptions which how many people would really believe? In other words, if you’re out there, you’re talking to a normal person and he’s eating a hamburger, and you say, well, if you continue eating that, you’re going to have to take a… somebody’s going to eat you, or you’re going to have to eat something else. So how do you take that particular idealism and give it to someone to make them sincere or help them understand these principles of the Bhagavatam? It’s tough. That’s why the principle which I find is best is choose our battles.

You know, there’s a very almost humorous conversation when Prabhupada was in Hawaii. Some devotees came and told him that, Prabhupada, when you try to talk with the scholars, and we tell the scholars that that in Dwarka, the King Ugrasen had some astronomical number of bodyguards. It’s quite a phenomenal number.

So they start laughing at us. Where were their toilets? Where were their homes? How could they live in Dwarka? Now, Prabhupada could have… Dwarka? It was here only? Or maybe it was two different places also. So anyway, Prabhupada took a different approach at a different time.

Prabhupada, here, he said that in this conversation, among all the sections of the Bhagavatam, was it the only thing you found to speak to the scholars? So, it is… Choose our battles means what? Prabhupada himself says, intelligence means to see things in their proper perspective. That’s what he says in the 10th chapter of the Bhagavad Gita. 10.345 So that means, we ourselves need to know what are the big things in our philosophy and what are the not so big things.

So, from Sri Prabhupada’s example itself, we know how often did Prabhupada talk about hell. Generally, when he talked about giving up sense gratification, it is not that you will go to hell if you do sense gratification. That is the general Christian version of, they use the word adultery, adultery or fornication.

You will go to hell and you will suffer in hell. Prabhupada’s approach was, this pleasure is so insignificant. You are meant for far greater pleasure.

So, Prabhupada took a particular approach. My understanding is, first is, we don’t talk about it ourselves. And we don’t… This could work as a deterrent at a particular time.

Now, it doesn’t work as a deterrent. And that’s why we are having this discussion about how to explain it. So, to some extent, it is possible, although there is so much propaganda about sense gratification in the world today.

Many people soon realise that there is nothing so great about it. It’s just that because they don’t know any alternative, they keep trying it. And they keep trying it in new ways to hope that they will get some pleasure.

But for many people, if they can be presented Krishna Consciousness in an attractive way and they experience the happiness of Krishna Consciousness, then, okay, you know, there is a better way to live. And that’s how they give up sense gratification. So, I think that’s the much more healthier approach rather than… So, I think this is the approach of intelligence rather than experience.

That, you know, there is a better way to live. There is a better way to enjoy life. And so, we… Nowadays, there is enough arguments.

Like, we can make health arguments for giving up meat. We can make arguments based on environment which is a big concern for people. There is also an argument based on… I talk about meat-eating.

I talk about help the world with your food. I talk about four things. One is, at a health level, it is beneficial.

At the environmental level, it is beneficial. At the level of livestock, you know, so many people are killed just for your food. And then, at the level of poverty itself, global poverty.

That is, if the amount of land that is used to make meat is used to raise grains for human beings, then, far more people can be fed. So, poverty itself… And this is not just us. UNESCO has said that.

So, this is basically… There are different ways. That’s why I said… I gave the example of what Chaitanya Mahaprabhu said. There is no need for this.

And Baldev Ji said, we have to do this. We have to write a commentary on Vedanta Sutra. So, I think the same purpose, but different approaches to that purpose.

I personally wouldn’t use hell at all to talk about it to people. Thank you.

The post How can we get a Westerner to believe that if one eats cow flesh, one will become a cow in a future life who will then be eaten? appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

Today is Sita-navami, the appearance day of Srimati Sitadevi, the eternal consort of Lord Ramachandra. She appeared as the daughter of King Janaka, one of the twelve mahajanas, great authorities in Krishna consciousness, and thus one of her names is Janaki. In Valmiki’s Ramayana, Sita is said to have been discovered in a furrow in a ploughed field believed to now be the city of Sitamarhi in the Mithila region of present-day Bihar, and for that reason she is regarded as a daughter of Bhumi Devi (the goddess earth).

 To begin, we shall read from Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila, Chapter Nine: “Lord Caitanya’s Travels to the Holy Places.”

TEXT 2

jaya jaya sri-caitanya jaya nityananda
jayadvaita-candra jaya gaura-bhakta-vrnda

TRANSLATION

All glories to Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu! All glories to Lord Nityananda Prabhu! All glories to Sri Advaita Prabhu! And all glories to all the devotees of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu!

TEXT 178

daksina-mathura aila kamakosthi haite
tahan dekha haila eka brahmana-sahite

TRANSLATION

When Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu arrived at southern Mathura from Kamakosthi, He met a brahmana.

TEXTS 179–193

The brahmana who met Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu invited the Lord to his home. This brahmana was a great devotee and an authority on Lord Sri Ramacandra. He was always detached from material activities.

After bathing in the river Krtamala, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu went to the brahmana’s house to take lunch, but He saw that the food was unprepared because the brahmana had not cooked it.

Seeing this, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, “My dear sir, please tell Me why you have not cooked. It is already noon.”

The brahmana replied, “My dear Lord, we are living in the forest. For the time being we cannot get all the ingredients for cooking.

“When Laksmana brings all the vegetables, fruits, and roots from the forest, Sita will do the necessary cooking.”

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was very satisfied to hear about the brahmana’s method of worship. Finally the brahmana hastily made arrangements for cooking.

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu took His lunch at about three o’clock, but the brahmana, being very sorrowful, fasted.

While the brahmana was fasting, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu asked him, “Why are you fasting? Why are you so unhappy? Why are you so worried?”

The brahmana replied, “I have no reason to live. I shall give up my life by entering either fire or water.

“My dear sir, Mother Sita is the mother of the universe and the supreme goddess of fortune. She has been touched by the demon Ravana, and I am troubled upon hearing this news.

“Sir, due to my unhappiness I cannot continue living. Although my body is burning, my life is not leaving.”

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu replied, “Please do not think this way any longer. You are a learned pandita. Why don’t you consider the case?”

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu continued, “Sitadevi, the dearmost wife of the Supreme Lord Ramacandra, certainly has a spiritual form full of bliss. No one can see her with material eyes, for no materialist has such power.

“To say nothing of touching Mother Sita, a person with material senses cannot even see her. When Ravana kidnapped her, he kidnapped only her material, illusory form.

“As soon as Ravana arrived before Sita, she disappeared. Then just to cheat Ravana she sent an illusory, material form.”

TEXT 194

aprakrta vastu nahe prakrta-gocara
veda-puranete ei kahe nirantara

TRANSLATION

“Spiritual substance is never within the jurisdiction of the material conception. This is always the verdict of the Vedas and Puranas.”

PURPORT by Srila Prabhupada

As stated in the Katha Upanisad (2.3.9, 12):

na sandrse tisthati rupam asya
  na caksusa pasyati kascanainam
hrda manisa manasabhiklpto
  ya etad vidur amrtas te bhavanti
naiva vaca na manasa
  praptum sakyo na caksusa

“Spirit is not within the jurisdiction of material eyes, words, or mind.”

Similarly, Srimad-Bhagavatam (10.84.13) states:

yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke
  sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih
yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij
  janesv abhijnesu sa eva go-kharah

“A human being who identifies his body made of three elements with his self, who considers the by-products of his body to be his kinsmen, who considers the land of his birth worshipable, and who goes to a place of pilgrimage simply to take a bath rather than to meet men of transcendental knowledge there is to be considered like an ass or a cow.”

These are some Vedic statements about spiritual substance. Spiritual substance cannot be seen by the unintelligent, because they do not have the eyes or the mentality to see the spirit soul. Consequently they think that there is no such thing as spirit. But the followers of the Vedic injunctions take their information from Vedic statements, such as the verses from the Katha Upanisad and Srimad-Bhagavatam quoted above.

COMMENT by Giriraj Swami

We know from Srila Prabhupada, from the Padma Purana, quoted in Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu and also Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya 17.133:

 nama cintamanih krsnas
  caitanya-rasa-vigrahah
purnah suddho nitya-mukto
  ’bhinnatvan nama-naminoh

Namah cintamanih krsnah: the holy name of Krishna is Krishna Himself. Caitanya-rasa-vigrahah: it is the form of rasa, the reservoir of pleasure. It is purna, complete; suddha, pure; and nitya-mukta, always free from material contamination. Why? Because there is no difference between the holy name of Krishna and the possessor of the name, Krishna Himself (abhinnatvan nama-naminoh).

Now, the question arises, “Since the Lord is spiritual and beyond the jurisdiction of material senses, how can one with materially covered senses touch, or chant and hear, the holy name of Krishna?” In the next verse of the Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu, Srila Rupa Gosvami explains:

 atah sri-krsna-namadi
  na bhaved grahyam indriyaih
sevonmukhe hi jihvadau
  svayam eva sphuraty adah

Atah means “therefore,” as in athatho brahma-jijnasa. Atah: therefore (that is, because the holy name of Krishna is completely spiritual like Krishna) one cannot chant or hear the holy name—touch the holy name—with materially contaminated senses. However, if we engage our senses in the service of the Lord and the Lord becomes pleased with our service, then the Lord will reveal Himself to us.

In other words, although we cannot perceive the Lord with materially contaminated senses, the Lord can reveal Himself to us when He is pleased by our service; He can purify our senses and make Himself visible to us.

When even a sadhaka, a devotee who is practicing devotional service, cannot touch even the holy name of the Lord, how could a demon like Ravana see or touch Mother Sita, who is directly the spiritual energy of the Lord? It is not possible. What Ravana saw and touched was not the original Sita but maya Sita, an illusory representation of the original Sita. Thus Lord Chaitanya was consoling the brahman: “Don’t lament that Mother Sita has been touched by the demon Ravana. The demon Ravana could not even see her, what to speak of touch her. There is no need to lament.”

TEXT 195

visvasa karaha tumi amara vacane
punarapi ku-bhavana na kariha mane

TRANSLATION

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu then assured the brahmana, “Have faith in My words and do not burden your mind any longer with this misconception.”

PURPORT

This is the process of spiritual understanding. Acintya khalu ye bhava na tams tarkena yojayet: “We should not try to understand things beyond our material conception by argument and counterargument.” Maha-jano yena gatah sa panthah: “We have to follow in the footsteps of great authorities coming down in the parampara system.” If we approach a bona fide acarya and keep faith in his words, spiritual realization will be easy.

COMMENT

In the material world everyone is acting independently. Actually, people are not independent, but they imagine themselves to be independent. They want to think for themselves, see for themselves, make their own decisions, make their own plans. Even when they come to the subject of God, they keep the same attitude: “I don’t need anyone to tell me about God. I can think for myself; I can decide for myself.” Or they may accept some authority according to their liking. Many people go to various authorities and pick and choose what they like from each, and in the end they find confirmation for whatever they thought or wanted to begin with. That is not the way to understand God. Rather, one must approach a bona fide spiritual master and surrender. Surrender means no wavering to this side or that side. One must remain fixed in submission and obedience to the spiritual master and accept the spiritual master’s instructions without argument.

Of course, the whole process is based on faith, and therefore Lord Chaitanya’s first words are visvasa karaha tumi amara vacane: “Have faith in My words.” If you do, He says, you will be relieved of your suffering. But if you don’t have faith in His words, you’ll go on suffering and nobody will be able to help you.

visvasa karaha tumi amara vacane
punarapi ku-bhavana na kariha mane

“Have faith in My words and do not burden your mind any longer with this misconception.”

TEXT 196

prabhura vacane viprera ha-ila visvasa
bhojana karila, haila jivanera asa

 TRANSLATION

Although the brahmana was fasting, he had faith in the words of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and accepted food. In this way his life was saved.

COMMENT

The brahman was fasting because he thought that Ravana had touched Sita and kidnapped her. He was ready to give up his life, but because he had faith in the words of Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, he gave up his misconception, took prasada, and saved his life.

TEXT 197

tanre asvasiya prabhu karila gamana
krtamalaya snana kari aila durvasana

TRANSLATION

After thus assuring the brahmana, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu proceeded further into southern India and finally arrived at Durvasana, where He bathed in the river Krtamala.

TEXT 199

setubandhe asi’ kaila dhanus-tirthe snana
ramesvara dekhi’ tahan karila visrama

 TRANSLATION

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu then went to Setubandha [Ramesvara], where He took His bath at the place called Dhanus-tirtha. From there He visited the Ramesvara temple and then took rest.

PURPORT

The path from Mandapam through the ocean to the island known as Pambam consists partly of sand and partly of water. The island of Pambam is about seventeen miles long and six miles wide. On this island, four miles north of Pambam Harbor, is Setubandha, where the temple of Ramesvara is located. This is a temple of Lord Siva, and the name Ramesvara indicates that he is a great personality whose worshipable Deity is Lord Rama. Thus the Lord Siva found in the temple of Ramesvara is a great devotee of Lord Ramacandra. It is said, devi-pattanam arabhya gaccheyuh setu-bandhanam: “After visiting the temple of the goddess Durga, one should go to the temple of Ramesvara.”

In this area there are twenty-four different holy places, one of which is Dhanus-tirtha, located about twelve miles southeast of Ramesvara. It is near the last station of the South Indian Railway, a station called Ramnad. It is said that here, on the request of Ravana’s younger brother Vibhisana, Lord Ramacandra destroyed the bridge to Lanka with His bow while returning to His capital. It is also said that one who visits Dhanus-tirtha is liberated from the cycle of birth and death, and that one who bathes there gets all the fruitive results of performing the yajna known as Agnistoma.

COMMENT

It is said that when Lord Rama was on the way to Lanka, He worshipped a deity of Lord Shiva. Some ignorant people say, “Because Lord Rama worshipped Lord Shiva, Lord Shiva is the Supreme and Lord Rama is subordinate to him.” But actually, the opposite is true: Lord Shiva himself is a great devotee of Lord Rama. Sometimes, however, the Lord likes to serve His devotees, as in the case of Krishna and Yasoda. Krishna used to obey the dictations of Yasoda, but that doesn’t mean that Yasoda is God. Krishna used to carry the shoes of Nanda Maharaja, but that doesn’t mean that Nanda Maharaja is God. Krishna drove the chariot of Arjuna, but that doesn’t mean that Arjuna is greater than Krishna. Krishna washed the feet of Sudama Vipra, but that doesn’t mean that Sudama is superior to Krishna. The Lord takes pleasure in worshipping His devotees. Lord Ramachandra wanted to glorify His devotee Shiva, and therefore He may have worshipped him.

Other ignorant people say that because Ravana was a devotee of Lord Shiva, Rama approached Lord Shiva to ask his permission before killing Ravana. Once, at Juhu Beach, a disciple mentioned this idea to Srila Prabhupada, and Prabhupada replied that people who say that Lord Rama had Lord Shiva’s permission to kill Ravana want to say that Lord Shiva is a rascal, that he would give permission for someone to kill his devotee: “Oh, yes. He is my devotee, but it’s all right—you can kill him.” Prabhupada said they want to prove that Lord Shiva is a rascal. Rather, he said—and he quoted the shastra—when Rama was in the process of killing Ravana, Mother Parvati asked Lord Shiva, “Ravana is your great devotee, and now he is in trouble. Why don’t you do something to help him?” And Lord Shiva replied, “Lord Rama is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. When He wants to kill Ravana, what can I do?”

TEXT 200

vipra-sabhaya sune tanha kurma-purana
tara madhye aila pativrata-upakhyana

TRANSLATION

There, among the brahmanas, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu listened to the Kurma Purana, wherein is mentioned the chaste woman’s narration.

PURPORT

Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura remarks that only two khandas of the Kurma Purana are now available, namely the Purva-khanda and Uttara-khanda. Sometimes it is said that the Kurma Purana contains six thousand verses, but according to Srimad-Bhagavatam the original Kurma Purana contains seventeen thousand verses. It is considered the fifteenth of the eighteen Maha-puranas.

TEXT 201

pativrata-siromani janaka-nandini
jagatera mata sita—ramera grhini

TRANSLATION

Srimati Sitadevi is the mother of the three worlds and the wife of Lord Ramacandra. Among chaste women she is supreme, and she is the daughter of King Janaka.

TEXT 202

ravana dekhiya sita laila agnira sarana
ravana haite agni kaila sitake avarana

TRANSLATION

When Ravana came to kidnap Mother Sita and she saw him, she took shelter of the fire-god, Agni. The fire-god covered the body of Mother Sita, and in this way she was protected from the hands of Ravana.

TEXT 203

‘maya-sita’ ravana nila, sunila akhyane
suni’ mahaprabhu haila anandita mane

TRANSLATION

Upon hearing from the Kurma Purana how Ravana had kidnapped a false form of Mother Sita, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu became very satisfied.

TEXT 204

sita lana rakhilena parvatira sthane
‘maya-sita’ diya agni vancila ravane

TRANSLATION

The fire-god, Agni, took away the real Sita and brought her to the place of Parvati, goddess Durga. An illusory form of Mother Sita was then delivered to Ravana, and in this way Ravana was cheated.

TEXT 205

raghunatha asi’ yabe ravane marila
agni-pariksa dite yabe sitare anila

After Ravana was killed by Lord Ramacandra, Sitadevi was brought before the fire and tested.

TEXT 206

tabe maya-sita agni kari antardhana
satya-sita ani’ dila rama-vidyamana

TRANSLATION

When the illusory Sita was brought before the fire by Lord Ramacandra, the fire-god made the illusory form disappear and delivered the real Sita to Lord Ramacandra.

TEXT 207

sunina prabhura anandita haila mana
ramadasa-viprera katha ha-ila smarana

TRANSLATION

When Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu heard this story, He was very pleased, and He remembered the words of Ramadasa Vipra.

TEXT 208

e-saba siddhanta suni’ prabhura ananda haila
brahmanera sthane magi’ sei patra nila

TRANSLATION

Indeed, when Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu heard these conclusive statements from the Kurma Purana, He felt great happiness. After asking the brahmanas’ permission, He took possession of the manuscript leaves of the Kurma Purana.

TEXT 209

nutana patra lekhana pustake deoyaila
pratiti lagi’ puratana patra magi’ nila

TRANSLATION

Since the Kurma Purana was very old, the manuscript was also very old. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu took possession of the original leaves in order to have direct evidence. The text was copied onto new leaves in order that the Purana be replaced.

TEXT 210

patra lana punah daksina-mathura aila
ramadasa vipre sei patra ani dila

TRANSLATION

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu returned to southern Mathura [Madurai] and delivered the original manuscript of the Kurma Purana to Ramadasa Vipra.

TEXTS 211–212

sitayaradhito vahnis
  chaya-sitam ajijanat
tam jahara dasa-grivah
  sita vahni-puram gata

 pariksa-samaye vahnim
  chaya-sita vivesa sa
vahnih sitam samaniya
  tat-purastad aninayat

TRANSLATION

“When he was petitioned by Mother Sita, the fire-god, Agni, brought forth an illusory form of Sita, and Ravana, who had ten heads, kidnapped the false Sita. The original Sita then went to the abode of the fire-god. When Lord Ramacandra tested the body of Sita, it was the false, illusory Sita that entered the fire. At that time the fire-god brought the original Sita from his abode and delivered her to Lord Ramacandra.”

PURPORT

These two verses are taken from the Kurma Purana.

TEXT 213

patra pana viprera haila anandita mana
prabhura carane dhari’ karaye krandana

TRANSLATION

Ramadasa Vipra was very pleased to receive the original leaf manuscript of the Kurma Purana, and he immediately fell down before the lotus feet of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and began to cry.

TEXTS 214–218

After receiving the manuscript, the brahmana, being very pleased, said, “Sir, You are Lord Ramacandra Himself and have come in the dress of a sannyasi to give me audience.

“My dear Sir, You have delivered me from a very unhappy condition. I request that You take Your lunch at my place. Please accept this invitation.

“Due to my mental distress I could not give You a very nice lunch the other day. Now, by good fortune, You have come again to my home.”

Saying this, the brahmana very happily cooked food, and a first-class dinner was offered to Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu.

Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu passed that night in the house of the brahmana. Then, after showing him mercy, the Lord started toward the Tamraparni River in Pandya-desa.

COMMENT

The chastity of Mother Sita is glorified in similar terms in the summary of the pastimes of Lord Ramachandra in the Ninth Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam. Because Ravana had been cursed by the anger of Mother Sita, his armies were vanquished and ultimately he was killed.

te ’nikapa raghupater abhipatya sarve
  dvandvam varutham ibha-patti-rathasva-yodhaih
jaghnur drumair giri-gadesubhir angadadyah
  sitabhimarsa-hata-mangala-ravanesan

 “Angada and the other commanders of the soldiers of Ramacandra faced the elephants, infantry, horses, and chariots of the enemy and hurled against them big trees, mountain peaks, clubs, and arrows. Thus the soldiers of Lord Ramacandra killed Ravana’s soldiers, who had lost all good fortune because Ravana had been condemned by the anger of Mother Sita.” (SB 9.10.20)

After Ravana had been killed, his wife, Mandodari, praised the power of Mother Sita’s chastity, addressing her husband:

na vai veda maha-bhaga
  bhavan kama-vasam gatah
tejo ’nubhavam sitaya
  yena nito dasam imam

“O greatly fortunate one, you came under the influence of lusty desires, and therefore you could not understand the influence of Mother Sita. Now, because of her curse, you have been reduced to this state, having been killed by Lord Ramacandra.” (SB 9.10.27) In his purport to this verse, Srila Prabhupada explains that any woman who follows the example of Mother Sita’s chastity and service can attain similar power—and that, in fact, women should follow her ideal example: “Not only was Mother Sita powerful, but any woman who follows in the footsteps of Mother Sita can also become similarly powerful. There are many instances of this in the history of Vedic literature. Whenever we find a description of ideal chaste women, Mother Sita is among them. Mandodari, the wife of Ravana, was also very chaste. Similarly, Draupadi was one of five exalted chaste women. As a man must follow great personalities like Brahma and Narada, a woman must follow the path of such ideal women as Sita, Mandodari, and Draupadi. By staying chaste and faithful to her husband, a woman enriches herself with supernatural power.”

Although Mother Sita was completely pure and chaste, some ignorant citizens criticized Lord Rama for accepting her back after she had been abducted by Ravana, and to preserve His authority as king—for the benefit of the citizens—He was obliged to consign her to the care of the great sage Valmiki Muni.

By her transcendental qualities and devotional service, Sitadevi attracted her husband, Lord Ramachandra, the Personality of Godhead. And after she completed her pastimes on earth, He remained absorbed in thought of her—while perfectly executing His royal duties—until He followed her, to continue their eternal lila in the spiritual world.

munau niksipya tanayau
  sita bhartra vivasita
dhyayanti rama-caranau
  vivaram pravivesa ha

“Being forsaken by her husband, Sitadevi entrusted her two sons to the care of Valmiki Muni. Then, meditating upon the lotus feet of Lord Ramacandra, she entered into the earth.” (SB 9.11.15)

tac chrutva bhagavan ramo
  rundhann api dhiya sucah
smarams tasya gunams tams tan
  nasaknod roddhum isvarah

 “After hearing the news of Mother Sita’s entering the earth, the Supreme Personality of Godhead was certainly aggrieved. Although He is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, upon remembering the exalted qualities of Mother Sita, He could not check His grief in transcendental love.” (SB 9.11.16) Of course, the Lord’s grief upon hearing the news of Sitadevi’s entering the earth was not material. In the spiritual world there are also feelings of separation, but such feelings are a manifestation of the Lord’s internal pleasure potency (hladini-sakti) and give rise to transcendental bliss—although they resemble the miserable feelings experienced by ordinary men and women who are materially attached to each other.

tata urdhvam brahmacaryam
  dharyann ajuhot prabhuh
trayodasabda-sahasram
  agnihotram akhanditam

“After Mother Sita entered the earth, Lord Ramacandra observed complete celibacy and performed an uninterrupted Agnihotra-yajna for thirteen thousand years.” (SB 9.11.18)

smaratam hrdi vinyasya
  viddham dandaka-kantakaih
sva-pada-pallavam rama
  atma-jyotir agat tatah

“After completing the sacrifice, Lord Ramacandra, whose lotus feet were sometimes pierced by thorns when He lived in Dandakaranya, placed those lotus feet in the hearts of those who always think of Him. Then He entered His own abode, the Vaikuntha planet beyond the brahmajyoti.” (SB 9.11.19)

Sri Sri Sita-Rama ki jaya!

There is an important lesson for all of us here, whether we are in a man’s body or a woman’s: Sitadevi is the energy of Lord Rama, the property of Lord Rama, and to take the property of the Lord for one’s sense gratification is demonic. Ravana was a scholar, a devotee of Lord Shiva, and he had many, many good qualifications. However, he had one fault that put him in the category of demons: he wanted to take the Lord’s property and enjoy it for himself. As we have been discussing—and maybe realizing—people in Kali-yuga have two sides: the devotee side and the demon side. The demon side wants to take the property of the Lord and enjoy it, like Ravana. So we must be careful that the demonic side does not become predominant. Otherwise, just as Ravana and his whole dynasty were destroyed, our spiritual life will be destroyed.

What is the difference between material and spiritual? When people challenge us, “You are living in a marble palace, you are using telephones, computers, tape recorders, and automobiles, so you are involved in materialism,” how do we reply? “We are using everything in the service of the Lord. What is used in the service of the Lord is no longer material; it becomes spiritual.” And it is true. The temple is spiritual because it is dedicated to the service of the Lord, and all the paraphernalia used in the Lord’s service is spiritual. So, there is no contamination. However, if we use the paraphernalia meant for the service of the Lord for our own sense gratification, then it is no longer spiritual; it becomes maya. Ravana wanted to take Rama’s Sita, but he couldn’t touch the original Sita. He could get only the maya Sita. Similarly, the Lord’s paraphernalia is spiritual when engaged in the Lord’s service, but if we try to use the same things for our sense gratification, they become maya.

We should not be complacent and assume, “I am a devotee, and everything I do is spiritual. Even if I handle money, it is spiritual because it’s for Krishna.” If it is for Krishna, it is spiritual, laksmi, but if it is used for our sense gratification, it becomes material, maya. So, we must be careful in every situation—in every activity, every transaction—to consider, “Am I doing this for Krishna or for sense gratification?” If an activity is done for Krishna, it becomes spiritual, but if that same activity is done for sense gratification, it becomes material. All the things we have, all the paraphernalia, which are meant for Krishna’s service, become maya if we use them for sense gratification. So, we should be very careful, especially if we take donations from the public, directly or indirectly. Even if we don’t directly take donations, we are using donations for our service, so we should take care that the donations we take from the public are used exclusively in transcendental devotional service and not one cent is used for sense gratification. If we use any of it for sense gratification, we are implicated in a cheating process, because the public think they are giving the money for Krishna’s service but in fact we are using it for sense gratification.

Srila Prabhupada said that if we take money in the name of Krishna’s service and then use it for sense gratification, we become debtors to the people who gave us the money. In other words, we are supposed to be only peons, carrying the money from the donor to the Lord—like Hanuman. He went to liberate Sita from Ravana not to keep her for himself but to deliver her to Lord Rama. We should be like Hanuman: we should liberate Sita from the hands of whomever and deliver her to Rama. We are not meant to touch her. If we do, we’ll have to come back in another life and pay our debt to the people from whom we took the money. These are subtle laws, and Srila Prabhupada was concerned that we should not become victims of our desires for sense gratification. Therefore he explained everything very clearly, so that we can be conscientious and use the Lord’s property only for the Lord’s service. Then we will be like Hanuman, the great devotee who got the mercy of Lord Rama. But if we try to use the Lord’s property for our sense gratification, we become like Ravana and will be destroyed.

On this occasion we pray to Mother Sita to bless us to become pure-hearted servants like Hanuman, Laksmana, and Mother Sita herself—and to save us. Whatever Ravana-like demonic tendencies we have, let them be vanquished by her mercy, by her will, so we may continue in our devotional service without any impediment and ultimately attain pure love (prema), our ultimate goal.

Sri Sri Sita-Rama-Laksmana-Hanuman ki jaya!
Sri Sita-navami ki jaya!
Srila Prabhupada ki jaya!
Nitai-gaura-premanande hari-haribol!

Gargamuni Prabhu (Gregory Michal Scharf), one of Srila Prabhupada’s earliest disciples and a founding officer of ISKCON, stands as a testament to dedicated service in the formative years of the Krishna Consciousness movement. His multifaceted contributions helped establish ISKCON’s financial foundation, publication efforts, and administrative structure during its most vulnerable early period. His story provides
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302.05: Asramas (spiritual orders) in ISKCON: General [Title] – Encouraging the establishment and maintenance of ISKCON temple asramas — 2025 [Meeting] – Annual General Meeting [Category] – Guideline [Date passed] – February 23, 2025 Whereas Srila Prabhupada established and built ISKCON upon the strength of temples with vibrant asramas; Whereas many if not most ISKCON
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411.02: ISKCON Harinama Sankirtana Ministry: Kirtana standards [Title] – Temple kirtana guidelines — 2025 [Meeting] – Annual General Meeting [Category] – Guideline [Date passed] – February 22, 2025 Whereas there is a need in ISKCON for clarity in temple room kirtana guidelines. Therefore it is resolved that: The GBC approves the Temple Kirtana Guidelines as
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Haven’t given anything yet to help complete Srila Prabhupada’s most important project, the Temple of the Vedic Planetarium (TOVP)? Want to give again? Have a look at the new TOVP Fundraising Campaigns-at-a-Glance brochure and see all the options to donate according to your means.

The new TOVP Campaigns-at-a-Glance brochure offers 26 categories of donation options with varying levels of sponsorship cost to give everyone, no matter what their monetary situation, the ability to participate in this historic project, set to open during a grand 3-day celebration from December, 2026 until Gaura Purnima, March, 2027.

View online or download the brochure.

 

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Diary of a Traveling Sadhaka, Vol. 21, No. 17

By Krishna Kripa Das
(Week 17: April 23–April 29, 2025)\
New York City, Oslo, Radhadesh, Liege, Amsterdam, Dinant, Paris
(Sent from Brussels, Belgium, on May 3, 2025)

Where I Went and What I Did

During the seventeenth week of 2025, I chanted in five countries, United States, Norway, Belgium, The Netherlands, and France, two days each in Belgium and France, and only one of the days I chanted by myself. 

The reason for my European trip was to fulfill my promise to Kadamba Kanana Swami back in 2008, to attend his King’s Day maha-harinama in Amsterdam every year. This is usually on April 27, although this day it was celebrated on April 26 because April 27 was Sunday. His disciples celebrate his Vyasa-puja at Radhadesh the day before and then go to Amsterdam for King’s Day. Mahavishnu Swami and Harinama Ruci came for King’s Day harinama, and they did harinamas in Belgium before and after, which I was happy to join.

I share a quote from Srila Prabhupada’s Sri Caitanya-caritamrita and The Nectar of Devotion as well as a few quotes from a Bhagavad-gita lecture in New York City in 1966. I share notes on classes by Jayadvaita Swami, Mahavishnu Swami, and Gopinatha Acarya Prabhu. At the end of the insights section, I share notes on offerings from the Kadamba Kanana Swami Vyasa-puja in Radhadesh on April 25, 2025.

Thanks to Krishna Dasa Prabhu of Antwerp for his kind donation at King’s Day. Thanks to Amoghadrik Krishna Prabhu of Oslo for arranging for me to take a nap, take prasadam, and go on harinama during my seven-hour layout there. Many, many thanks to Caitanya Candrodaya Prabhu, who had to stay up till midnight, getting me at the train station in Liège at nearly 11:00 p.m. and driving me to Radhadesh. Thanks to Gopinath Prabhu of Radhadesh for assisting me in my visit there. Thanks to Revatinandana Prabhu for his ride from Radhadesh to ISKCON Paris.

Itinerary

May 3: Ghent harinama
May 3–4: Amsterdam Kirtan Mela and Sacinandana Swami seminar
May 5: harinama in Amsterdam
May 6: harinama in Rotterdam
May 7: Flight from Amsterdam to New York City
May 8–June 15: NYC Harinam
mid June–mid August: Paris?
– June 22: Paris Ratha-yatra?
– July 11: Amsterdam harinama?
– July 12: Amsterdam Ratha-yatra?
– July 13: Netherlands harinama?

Chanting Hare Krishna in New York City

Because I had to leave before the NYC Harinam in the afternoon, I attempted to arrange a walking harinama in Downtown Brooklyn during lunch time. Nimai Prabhu of Delaware, who was visiting, and Karenna, who lives just a ten-minute walk from the Brooklyn temple kindly joined me. Here Karenna leads the Hare Krishna chant in Downtown Brooklyn (https://youtu.be/7lHr6ahHBe0):

Chanting Hare Krishna in Oslo

I was happy to find Oslo is a very efficient place. There were ten customs agents, so we only had to wait in the queue for five minutes instead of almost an hour like at some other places.

Leaving the security area of the Oslo airport to take the train to the city, I was struck by the intensity of the words chosen to communicate that idea – “Point of no return”.

Sanatani Devi Dasi, who I remember as being from Oslo, kindly connected me with Amoghadrik Krishna Prabhu, who arranged for my nap, prasadam, and harinama during my seven-hour layover in that city. Amoghadrik at one point in his life used to maintain a daily harinama there, and so he was enthusiastic to assist me. He was able to convince one friend to come named Kristofer.

Here Kristofer chants Hare Krishna at Oslo Central Station (https://youtu.be/6vipkpLjZek):

Amoghadrik Krishna Prabhu chants Hare Krishna at Oslo Central Station, and a guy dances (https://youtu.be/ksVDTujNwoc):

I chanted Hare Krishna from our ISKCON through the streets to Oslo Central Station, and then again at the station, just before boarding my train back to the airport (https://youtu.be/a3xQq7KdQLw):

Chanting Hare Krishna in Belgium

After a long day of travel and just missing one train to find the next one canceled, I was happy I stumbled into the quiet coach on this Belgium train so I could try to finish my Ekadasi japa on my way to Radhadesh. The signs in French and Dutch make it clear that the car must be silent, and thankfully it was.

Here devotees chant Hare Krishna after Guru Puja in Radhadesh (https://youtu.be/xrMywl1AwFc):

On Friday after the midday feast for the Kadamba Kanana Swami Vyasa-puja, Mahavishnu Swami and Harinama Ruci, along with some attendees at the festival did harinama in Liège. Many people were happy to chant the mantra when encouraged by Mahavishnu Swami (https://youtu.be/5RhtSr0sVN4):

Mahavishnu Swami chants Hare Krishna after Guru Puja in Radhadesh on Sunday morning (https://youtu.be/zDjB-6FAOn8):

On Sunday after breakfast, Mahavishnu Swami and Harinama Ruci and some devotees chanted in Dinant, a small city beautifully situated along the Meuse River.

There is a castle on the hill overlooking the city and a large cathedral.

Dinant is famous as the birthplace of Adolphe Sax, the inventor of the saxophone. Consequentially you see saxophones all over the city.

For the occasion, Mahavishnu Swami changed the settings on his mini-synthesizer to make it sound like a saxophone instead of a harmonium.

Mahavishnu Swami invited many people at outside cafes to chant the mantra, but the people were much more reluctant than in Liège. Still a few people were very happy to meet the devotees and chant Hare Krishna and dance ():

Here Mahavishnu Swami chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and a Portuguese couple chants and dances (https://youtu.be/-BV6ohawgmQ):

Once when Harinamananda Prabhu was chanting Hare Krishna in Dinant, four people at a table in an outside cafe chanted the response, and then Vishnujana Prabhu went for a short ride on motorcycle as the kirtan continued (https://youtu.be/RrTVguQxPEg):

Harinamananda Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and devotees dance in a circle (https://youtu.be/68Al_uDMgK8):

Harinamananda Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and a bride and her bridesmaids dance (https://youtu.be/UoDMAoA8CsM):

Harinamananda Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and a mother chants the mantra (https://youtu.be/2QKPeBD0iS8):

Harinamananda Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and a woman at an information booth chants the mantra (https://youtu.be/wjDr2NV7idY):

Harinamananda Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Dinant, and two guys chant the mantra (https://youtu.be/tLUlW_rB3tk):

Chanting Hare Krishna in Amsterdam at King’s Day

For about two decades, two hundred friends and followers of Kadamba Kanana Swami have chanted for six-hours or so in the crowded Amsterdam streets on King’s Day, the anniversary of the birth of the King of the Netherlands, April 27. Previously it was called Queen’s Day and was April 30.

Here are the devotees who participated this year.

Here Keshava Swami chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam at beginning of the King’s Day harinama (https://youtu.be/7CqdYickY00):

Many people greeted us with smiles and accepted literature, prasadam, invitations to the temple and the upcoming kirtan mela, Jagannatha stickers, and flags with Hare Krishna written on them.

Gour Mohan Prabhu chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam on King’s Day (https://youtu.be/RmSAXxAW0TA):

Onlookers enjoy dancing with devotees at Museumplein in Amsterdam on King’s Day (https://youtu.be/ZoKwcpprGt4):

Harinama Devi Dasi chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam on King’s Day (https://youtu.be/d0ZbLBHP1nE):

Parividha Prabhu, Prabhupada disciple, performer, and resident of Amsterdam, chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam on King’s Day, and many dance (https://youtu.be/xGVsmQZev7U):

Rati Manjari Devi Dasi chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam on King’s Day, and many dance (https://youtu.be/li-JVrOC9w4):

Mahavishnu Swami chants Hare Krishna in Amsterdam on King’s Day (https://youtu.be/j_lGv8O3ZHk):

Dayal Mora Prabhu of London chants Hare Krishna on King’s Day in Amsterdam, and several young people chant and dance (https://youtu.be/LqLBZsNKODo):

While Vraja Krishna Prabhu was chanting Hare Krishna, we came upon some drummers who were happy to jam with us (https://youtu.be/Yc5tmb74BWc):

Vraja Krishna Prabhu chants Hare Krishna as we enter Vondelpark, a place that Srila Prabhupada personally visited, and many dance (https://youtu.be/j-Qmu6re_Io):

Chanting Hare Krishna in Paris

After lunch at Radhadesh on Sunday, I traveled with Paris devotees to our temple there. Monday and Tuesday I did harinama in Paris. Unfortunately no one joined me on Monday, but we had a party of four brahmacaris on Tuesday. At least six passersby were happy to play the shakers which I invited them to play, and I passed out several copies of the French edition of “On Chanting Hare Krishna,” which I had obtained from Montreal devotees. The book distributors did as well as usual that day. Because I dropped my phone while boarding the bus on Monday, I was unable to take videos of our Tuesday harinama.

Insights

Srila Prabhupada:

From Sri Caitanya-caritamrita, Adi 3.52, purport:

“Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but He always engages in describing Krishna and thus enjoys transcendental bliss by chanting and remembering His name and form.”

“Lord Caitanya taught Krishna consciousness and chanted the name of Krishna. Therefore, to worship Lord Caitanya, everyone should together chant the maha-mantra—Hare Krishna, Hare Krishna, Krishna Krishna, Hare Hare / Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare.”

From Sri Caitanya-caritamrita, Adi 3.60:

“The sinful life of the living beings results from ignorance. To destroy that ignorance, He [Lord Caitanya] has brought various weapons, such as His plenary associates, His devotees and the holy name.”

From Sri Caitanya-caritamrita, Adi 3.62:

“Raising His arms, chanting the holy name and looking upon all with deep love, He [Lord Caitanya] drives away all sins and floods everyone with love of Godhead.”

From Sri Caitanya-caritamrita, Adi 3.63:

“May the Supreme Personality of Godhead in the form of Lord Sri Caitanya bestow His causeless mercy upon us. His smiling glance at once drives away all the bereavements of the world, and His very words enliven the auspicious creepers of devotion by expanding their leaves. Taking shelter of His lotus feet invokes transcendental love of God at once.”

From The Nectar of Devotion, Chapter 22 (64. Krishna’s Exquisite Beauty):

“In Rupa Gosvami’s Lalita-madhava, it is said, ‘One day Krishna happened to see the shadow of His beautiful form reflected on the jeweled foreground. Upon seeing this bodily reflection, He expressed His feelings: “How wonderful it is that I have never seen such a beautiful form! Although it is My own form, still, like Radharani, I am trying to embrace this form and enjoy celestial bliss.”’ This statement shows how Krishna and His shadow reflection are one and the same. There is no difference between Krishna and His shadow reflection, nor between Krishna and His picture. That is the transcendental position of Krishna.”

From a class on Bhagavad-gita 4.19–22 in New York on August 5, 1966:

“We may begin any gorgeous task—it doesn’t matter—but we have to work in Krishna consciousness, not for sense gratification. That will make us free from the interaction of the activities. So long we are attached to work for sense gratification, so long we shall be under the obligation of reaction.”

“A person in Krishna consciousness should not be attached either to the good result or bad result, because even if I want good result, that is my attachment. And of course, if there is bad result, we haven’t got any attachment, but sometimes we lament. That is our attachment. That is our attachment. So one has to transcend both from the good result and the bad result.”

“How it can be done? It can be done. Just like if you are working on account of some big firm. Suppose you are a salesman. You are working on behalf of that big firm. Now, suppose if you make one million dollars’ profit, you have no attachment for that, because you know that ‘This profit goes to the proprietor.’ You have no attachment. Similarly, if there is some loss, you also know that ‘I have nothing to do with the loss. It goes to the proprietor.’”

“Everything has been very nicely discussed in Vedic literature.”

“Suppose if you want to take things which has been eaten by Krishna, then you have to ask Krishna, ‘What do You desire to eat, Sir?’ Suppose if you want me to feed, give me some foodstuff, naturally you ask me, ‘Swamiji, what sort of foodstuff you’ll like?’ I have got experience here in your country. I was invited in Butler, here also, by some churches, and they wanted to give me some food. So they asked me, ‘Swamiji, what do you desire to eat?’ So I told them, ‘. . . I am strictly vegetarian. I shall accept . . . fruits and milk. That's all.’ Similarly, if anyone invites somebody, it is natural that the guest is asked what sort of foodstuff he would like.

“Similarly, Krishna, if you want to offer something Krishna, you must know what sort of foodstuff He wants. . . . How you will know that Krishna wants this foodstuff? Oh, that is stated in the Bhagavad-gita.”

“Just like you can understand what government expects from me, you can know from the law books, from the civil court, similarly, what Krishna wants, it is stated in the Bhagavad-gita.”

“It doesn’t matter that because Krishna was, I mean to say, Krishna appeared in India, therefore He wanted Indian food. No.”

“If you simply don't try to increase your artificial demands for maintaining this body... You have every right to live, and everyone has got right to live, not only myself. Even the ant has got the right to live. But in human society, by our so-called civilization, we give all protection to the human society but we don't give any protection to the animal society. Because it is due to want of Krishna consciousness.”

“Prajalpa means for nothing talking nonsense. People are accustomed to talk so many things unnecessarily just in clubs, amongst friends’ circle, which has no benefit either spiritually or materially. So that sort of talking should be avoided.”

“There are many rules and regulation in India which is different from your rules and regulation. But if I follow, if I stick to rules and regulation of Indian conception, then it is impossible to remain here. So I have to propagate this mission, Krishna consciousness, so I am not so much attached to the rules and regulation, but I am attached to the preaching work.”

“Prasidhyati means it flourishes; the cause is advanced.” [While describing the six items which promote Krishna consciousness in The Nectar of Instruction, verse 3.]

“So sadhu-saṅga, we have to make association with persons who are spiritually interested and who are trying to culture Krishna consciousness. That association.”

“Sometimes we are faced with persons who are envious to us, but we should not be envious. Just like the best example is Lord Jesus Christ. His enemies who crucified him, they are envious of Jesus Christ. But Lord Jesus Christ, he was not envious to them. When he was being crucified, he prayed God, ‘O Lord, they do not know what they are doing. Please excuse them.’ Just see how much, I mean to say, noble he was. Vimatsarah. He was not envious to anyone, even to his enemy. So Krishna consciousness teaches us that they are not envious even to the enemies.”

Jayadvaita Swami:

From a online address for the Kadamba Kanana Swami Vyasa-puja:

Kadamba Kanana Swami was always daring and active, as Srila Prabhupada described.

We should meditate on the spiritual master at least three times a day, and become inspired.

We should not expect an instant payback from our enthusiasm. Patience is required. We cannot demand from Krishna.

Mahavishnu Swami:

There was a folk singer in the sixties who was a mouthpiece of the hippies who made people feel better.

There was a movie on my flight from Dubai to Brussels about Bob Dylan. I never watched movies, but I thought I would take a risk. As I saw the film I noticed Bob Dylan never smiled. He was not a happy man. I was glad I met Srila Prabhupada and his devotees.

The same magic that was there in Tompkins Square Park we saw at Vondelpark in Amsterdam yesterday, all the young people dancing to the Hare Krishna chant.

Animals do not know they are suffering in the cycle of birth and death.

The leaders do not know the goal of life. People are frustrated because they do not know the goal of life.

In Liege, in two hours we distributed 50 books, because of the power of the holy name.

I asked Navina Nirada Prabhu the difference between distributing books alone and distribution books with a harinama. Distributing books alone is like a man with a fishing rod fishing, and distributing books with a harinama is like you throw a stick of dynamite in the pond and the fish float to the surface.

Book distribution during harinama is like sense gratification because it is so easy.

My parents did not tell me, the school did not tell me, even the Bible, although I appreciated Jesus, did not tell me, that I am not a body but a spiritual soul.

The holy names cleanse our hearts, ceto darpana, and awaken our knowledge that it is true that we are not our bodies.

Q: Enthusiasm is contagious, but sometimes it is difficult. You have enthusiam. Tell us.

A: ISKCON is a hospital for conditioned souls with the disease that they do not believe Krishna is the Personality of Godhead. The more we believe that Krishna is the Personality of Godhead, the more we will be enthusiatic.

During the hippie times, because of George Harrison and Beatles the Hare Krishna mantra people were attracted.

We have to give our association to the people.

This was the best King’s Day parade. Wonderful weather, kirtan, and prasadam.

Gopinatha Acarya Prabhu:

From a class on Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.3.21 in Radhadesh on April 25, 2025:

Our idea is to preserve knowledge you should write it down, but the Vedic idea is that paper breaks down very easily, especially in the Indian climate, so it is better to memorize, and learn from someone who has memorized it.

The spiritual master, because he is constantly reciting the Vedic knowledge, is very much the representative of Vyasadeva.

Because the knowledge was not written down, the guru was the only way to access the knowledge.

The guru is fixed in the knowledge of Brahman in the form of the Vedas and in the form as the Supreme Brahman.

It is said only Brahma knows the Vedas because he was personally enlightened by the Lord.

The followers of Brahma would interpret the knowledge in terms of their own experience and thus many schools emerged.

When we hear from the guru, we hear through the mature realization of our guru, so we can come to a higher level.

Printing really took off after the 19^th century, especially the latter half of that century.

In 1872, only 3% of people could read or write. Seventy years later it was 70%.

Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura emphasizes the mass distribution of literature.

With many books in print, the guru seems to be less essential. But when we read the books ourselves, we interpret them through our own limited experience, instead through the mature realization of a bona fide guru.

Srila Prabhupada says the Sukadeva describes the universe which is very big, to glorify Krishna, who is even bigger.

Jiva Goswami explains the Bhagavatam is all about Krishna. Then he explains that the Bhagavatam is all about bhakti.

Kadamba Kanana Swami stresses that we do not surrender to the guru at the beginning of our spiritual life but at the beginning of everything we do.

At the end of the Svetasvatara Upanisad appears that verse that states how it can be realized: by faith in both the guru and Krishna. Tatha deve tatha guru.

In a talk in 1969 in Hamburg Srila Prabhupada stresses the guru is not a particular man but a truth and what is that truth: samsara davanala lidha loka – the truth that liberates you from samsara.

We go to the guru when we do not know, not to get confirmation of what we think we already know.

We have doubts about how one can attain perfection, and then we have the doubt if we can attain perfection. That doubt if we can attain perfection will be there until we actually do attain perfection.

It took a while before Arjuna understood what Krishna was saying.

Kadamba Kanana Swami stressed that the disciple has to interact with the guru so his doubts are eliminated.

When the spiritual master is no longer present, to go to him, we have to come up to his level of sadbe pare ca nisnatam, being fixed in Brahman.

Comment by Mahavishnu Swami: Sri Caitanya-caritamrita says that siksa- and diksa-gurus are both equal. Srila Prabhupada was my guru, but I had so many gurus who taught me how to distribute books, how to cook, etc.

In the beginning we may have a very fanatical understanding of our guru. Later we realize there are many people who teach us the same teachings that our guru does.

One devotee says that Bhaktivinoda Thakura said that a neophyte devotee cannot see the same teachings as his guru when they are expressed in different words.

Yadunandana Goswami was the diksa-guru of Raghunatha dasa Goswami, and Raghunatha dasa Goswami always offered respect to him and considered that his association with Lord Caitanya and Svarupa Damodara Goswami were accomplished by his guru’s mercy.

Comment by Parananda Prabhu: I was driving Kadamba Kanana Swami around Bratislava and he looked out the window and said with disdain, “Bratislava – a typically Kali-yuga city.” I could see he had no interest in this material world.

Notes on the Vyasa-puja of Kadamba Kanana Swami in Radhadesh

These notes are just a few of many wonderful appreciations of Kadamba Kanana Swami. They do not summarize the offerings or list the most important points. They are just a few things that grabbed my mind.

Rupa Sanatana Prabhu:

A very poetic offering . . . One line that grabbed me was:

“Souls cling together to be shattered at another death.”

Svayam Bhagavan Keshava Swami:

I recall my final meeting with Kadamba Kanana Swami. One day I sang a tune that he had told me he liked. A few days later, I had my last meeting with him, but I did not know it was my last meeting. He said, “Nice tune. But you killed it. The first part was fine, but then you went up instead of going low.”

I replied, “I don’t know the low part.”

Then he sang the low part until he did not have enough breath to continue.

Srila Prabhupada taught how be a spiritual being and also how to navigate the material world. You, Kadamba Kanana Swami, taught the same. You were my teacher in the practicalities of life, not just the spiritual.

Thank you for recruiting me into the greatest movement on earth.

Bhagavati Devi Dasi:

Our relationship has always beyond material boundaries. Now it is even more so.

When I finally became free from my entangling family life, then I spent years struggling with my rascal mind.

You said the goal of our relationship was to go back to Godhead, but later you said you wanted to come back and serve Srila Prabhupada.

Subhadra Prabhu:

We were moved by Kadamba Kanana Swami’s classes at the end of his life. We sold our restaurant, we went to holy dhama, and we prayed for inspiration, and the rest is history. [Now he and his wife will cook for the new Kadamba Cafe, to open on April 30 in the Brooklyn temple.]

Krishna Kirtana Prabhu:

Kadamba Kanana Swami would stay up till 1:30 a.m. watching the proceedings of the ISKCON NYC court case, he was so concerned about the development of NYC.

Uddhava Prabhu:

Many people do not know that to save the New Vraja Mandala farm project, he learned Spanish.

Gopali Devi Dasi:

I feel you are constantly present in my life. Perhaps that’s from my being part of the Kadamba Foundation service you gave me.

Thank you for the association of our god family.

He said after he told us he got cancer again, “who will you accept as guru now?” I said there is no one but you. He listed some names. I said I know them, but I do not have a relationship with them. There is someone you have on your altar, Jayadvaita Swami. I said, “I am afraid of him.” I had not met him at that point.

Kadamba Kanana Swami replied, “No, he is very sweet.”

Partha-sarathi Prabhu:

I came to tell the younger disciples: All it takes is to hang on to one moment, one kirtan, one look, etc., to maintain and develop the relationship with guru.

There used to be a disk with just ten offerings on it for Vyasa-puja.

I encourage those who are senior to mentor and encourage the newer ones. He wanted his disciples to have deep loving friendships, where we would do everything for each other as he would do everything for us.

One devotee wanted to have a fight with me. I told Kadamba Kanana Swami about that. He said I will meet him at the airport, and I will fight him myself. I said you don’t have to do that, I can take care of him myself. But that was his attitude of doing anything for us.

Kadamba Kanana Swami said, “Your service is to be normal and to be my friend.”

Harinamananda Prabhu:

You gave a life of service that will bring us to a life of eternal bliss and knowledge.

You accept everyone as they are, loving servants of Krishna.

By conquering our hearts you opened the doors to the spiritual world.

Vamsi Vadana Prabhu:

Thank you for giving me the faith that connects us.

You have confidence in the process of bhakti.

I have faith because you practice what you preach.

We got the mercy from you. Now we must share this with others.

I hope the mercy from you will be properly used by me.

The connection between you and Jayadvaita Swami is so inspiring for me.

Nitai Gaura Prabhu:

I am a younger disciple, but I got a lot of condensed mercy.

Kadamba Kanana Swami once said to me, “All you devotee kids think you are so special, you were demigods in your previous life, but actually you blew it, you didn’t make it back to Godhead. You came back.”

I said, “But you said you were a sannyasi in a higher planet in a previous life, why did you come back?”

He replied, “It is my causeless mercy.”

Just after Kadamba Kanana Swami recovered from cancer the first time, when Jayadaita Swami engaged him in assisting in New York City, he said, “If Jesus can do 40 days in the desert, I can do 50 days in the Brooklyn temple.”

He would say I am approaching 69, the age Srila Prabhupada started in America, I have to do so much more.

Gaura Mohan Prabhu:

He made us all grow.

He invested in a lot of projects:

to the blacks in South Africa, he gave 1 million rand for this work

feeding 250 to 350 people on Wednesday and teaching them to chant Hare Krishna

Woosa House campus programs, picnic, philosophical discussions, kirtanas.

Soweto Ratha-yatra, started in 2007, has grown very big.

Bhakti Yoga Society, student outreach wing of ISKCON South Africa. We have clubs on many campuses. We need to reach out to students.

Keshava Swami: I have done college preaching in different parts of the world, but in Johannesburg, South Africa, I saw 400 very intelligent and enthusiastic college students interested in Krishna consciousness.

There is a Kadamba Kanana Swami app with playlists of lectures and kirtanas and more. You can download material and listen to it when you are offline.

Disciples of Bhakti Vikasa Swami who made his app were inspired to help out.

Kadamba Kanana Swami lecture excerpts:

There are several who are not my disciples who have been around for a while. Keep them as part of my family.

ISKCON is also a branch of the Caitanya tree.

The parampara makes the fruit of transcendental knowledge sweet as it is passed down.

In life sometimes you are on top of the elephant and sometimes the elephant is on top of you.

I think this festival is good as it makes the bond stronger between me and you, and the bond between youselves stronger as well.

I thank you for your enthusiasm, service, and talents.

I dream of doing a Govardhan puja with a huge sila.

When we leave, we are left with our own vision, that we got here.

-----

This important verse, which Srila Prabhupada quoted 168 times according to the 2019 Vedabase, informs us that love of Krishna is eternally established in the heart. When our hearts are purified by devotional service beginning with hearing about Krishna, our love of Krishna becomes manifest. Srila Prabhupada would say that the fact that Westerners who had never heard of Krishna were soon willing to dedicate their lives to Him after chanting Hare Krishna and hearing Bhagavad-gita is evidence that love of Krishna is already there.

nitya-siddha krishna-prema ’sadhya’ kabhu naya

sravanadi-suddha-citte karaye udaya

“Pure love for Krishna is eternally established in the hearts of the living entities. It is not something to be gained from another source. When the heart is purified by hearing and chanting, this love naturally awakens.” (Sri Caitanya-caritamrita, Madhya 22.107)

How would you respond to a person who says, well, I like your conception much better than the Christian conception, but, you know, here in America, in Western countries, they have a saying, if you give a fool enough rope, he’ll hang himself. So it seems like Krishna is giving people a lot of rope. Why doesn’t he, you know, in the Bhagavad Gita it says, savastha cahamrti sannivishtho mataksmati agam Why doesn’t he, you know, cut us off at the pass, so to speak, before we hang ourselves?

Well, I would say hell is the way he cuts us off the path.

So it’s like when actions have consequences, that’s what brings us to our senses. So in general, one person can guide another person only in three ways. Like many times when parents ask, you know, how do we guide someone? How do we guide our children? There are broadly three ways.

First is conscience. That now conscience is like an innate voice. Something just cannot be done.

If we grew up seeing our parents never doing something, it’s out of question. No matter however angry you are, you don’t hit anyone. Then we ourselves start feeling it’s wrong.

So conscience is like the voice of emotion. But it’s not just emotional. It’s that innate sense.

This is like an inner compass. Now, if the compass is not there, then there is intelligence. Intelligence is where we appeal to a person.

We tell him if you do this, this is what is going to happen. Intelligence is where you give the person a vision of the consequence that is going to come. And if intelligence doesn’t work, then there is the experience.

Experience of what? Experience of the consequence. So broadly speaking, we cannot force anyone to do anything. Conscience is they just innately feel it’s wrong, so I can’t do it.

Intelligence is, okay, I see this is bad, so I’ll not do it. If somebody just feels, I don’t want to kill animals. I don’t want to hurt animals.

If I eat red meat, I’ll get a heart attack. I don’t want to do that. Somebody gets a heart attack, I say, okay, now no more eating red meat.

So basically there are three ways. So in one sense, hell is the way by which God is ensuring that the rope is not too long. So hell is where God is giving experience to people so that they can reform.

The post Why does a loving God give us such a long rope that we can hang ourselves with it? appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

H.G. Rasaraja Prabhu (also known as Prof. Ravi Gomatam) stands as a remarkable figure within ISKCON, exemplifying the harmonious integration of scientific inquiry and spiritual devotion. As a direct disciple of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada and current director of the Bhaktivedanta Institute (BI), he has dedicated over three decades to advancing
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Today is a most auspicious occasion. Mother Arca-vigraha was a very special devotee, and she really gave everything to Srila Prabhupada and Krishna and the devotees. I think of the verse akamah sarva-kamo va, moksa-kama udara-dhih / tivrena bhakti-yogena, yajeta purusam param, that akamah, whether one has no desires, sarva-kamo; or is full of desires, moksa-kama; or is desirous of liberation, tivrena bhakti-yogena, if one engages in bhakti-yoga to Krishna, tivrena, with great intensity—that is a very important point: with great intensity, and in a sense it doesn’t even matter what your service is, but if you give yourself to it fully, if you put your heart into it fully—then you can approach the Supreme Lord, the supreme destination.

akamah sarva-kamo va
  moksa-kama udara-dhih
tivrena bhakti-yogena
  yajeta purusam param

“A person who has broader intelligence, whether he is full of all material desire, is free from material desire, or has a desire for liberation, must by all means worship the supreme whole, the Personality of Godhead.” (SB 2.3.10)

Mother Arca-vigraha did that, and in a way, she was helped in the end by her pain—intense, difficult pain—because the only thing that gave her relief was hearing and chanting about Krishna. His Holiness Bhakti Bhrnga Govinda Swami Maharaja recounts an incident when he went in to see Arca in her room and she was literally crying in pain. Arca was a very strong woman, and she never complained, but she was in so much pain that she couldn’t control herself, and she was weeping, and Govinda Maharaja began to speak krsna-katha, about the pastimes of Krishna to her, and miraculously she stopped feeling the pain. She started to smile and laugh and enjoy the hearing and remembering of Krishna. So, she had discovered a secret: that as long as she was absorbed in Krishna, she could pretty much transcend the pain, but as soon as she was lax in remembering Krishna, the pain came back in full force. So, her pain actually helped her.

She was a very caring and compassionate person. She always gave her best to help devotees, and she genuinely liked and appreciated them. Sometimes even devotees who were considered renegades or somewhat eccentric in ISKCON would come to visit her, and she would always receive them and encourage them. Sometimes other devotees were worried and would mention these devotees’ bad reputations to her, how these devotees were perceived by others, but that didn’t stop her. She just wanted to extend herself to anyone and everyone, and she genuinely appreciated them as very dear friends.

She was a real artist. She found a way to convey deep spiritual truths in a new vocabulary of form and color. She did one series called The Eye Opener that illustrated different principles of Krishna consciousness. On occasion she’d put a little reference to a verse from the Bhagavad-gita, but the images themselves said so much. She displayed the first ones on her wall in her home in Johannesburg, and two completely different people became vegetarian just by seeing her depiction of meat-eaters sitting around the table, how they were developing the faces of animals. She conveyed that idea that by eating the flesh of animals, the eaters were becoming like animals and probably preparing their next birth as animals.

Her last desire, or one of her last desires, was that just as she loved Vrindavan and had all facility to associate with senior devotees in Vrindavan and relish the spiritual atmosphere of the dhama, she wanted others to have the same opportunity. And this desire—her compassion and her desire—gave rise to the idea of the hospice in Vrindavan, which has actually taken shape and is open and running. In my own life, her desire brought me into the field of devotee care in a very specific way, and that has also expanded into other ways and has brought me into the field of death and dying, and so I wrote my book Life’s Final Exam: Death and Dying in the Vedic Tradition.

Another of my books, Many Moons: Reflections on Departed Vaishnavas, deals with nine of Srila Prabhupada’s exalted departed followers, including Arca-vigraha. There are about two pages of pictures for each of the moonlike devotees. For Arca, one picture shows her at her initiation ceremony. She had her full head of red hair and was coming forward to get her beads. I gave her the name Arca-vigraha dasi because she was a painter, an artist—a sculptor also, but mainly a painter. Once, a disciple asked Srila Prabhupada, “Which of the nine processes is painting, and Srila Prabhupada replied, “Arcanam, decorating the form of the Lord.” So, I gave her the name Arca-vigraha devi dasi, and one of her important services became painting deities. She began with the Gaura-Nitai Deities in Muldersdrift, and she went on to do beautiful painting of Deities, Radha-Golokananda in Mauritius and Radha-Rasabihari in Juhu, and she even did the Deities in Vrindavan, although strictly speaking, it was against the rules for a woman to go into the Deity room. But Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhu arranged for her to come on the altar after all the Deities and the devotees had taken rest, and she painted the Deities between nine-thirty or ten at night and two or two-thirty in the morning. She would hardly eat or sleep—maybe an hour or two before she went to work. So, she did that service wonderfully—her painting of the Deities was beautiful.

Another picture shows Arca in front of her home in Ramana-reti. She had already retired to Vrindavan—she had cancer, but it wasn’t so bad yet, and she was still active and very blissful, happy to be in Vrindavan, very attached to chanting the holy name and hearing about Krishna. She had also begun to paint the deity of Vrindadevi at Vrinda-kunda. The pujari there had engaged her in painting the deity, with whom she had a special relationship, but it was near the end of her life, and using her arm had become quite painful. It was painful even otherwise, and so it was hard for her to paint, and she never completed the work. After she passed away, Bhakti Bhrnga Govinda Swami and I took some of the devotees who were in Vrindavan and were attached to her to Vrinda-kunda, and I mentioned to the pujari that she had felt sorry that she had not been able to complete her service to Vrindadevi. The pujari closed his eyes and then pointed upwards and said, “Now she will complete her service there.”

Arca also did a painting of Krishnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami to be placed in his renovated bhajana-kutira at Radha-kunda, and that was supposed to be a big secret, because the mahants at Radha-kunda, the babajis at that time, tended to see foreigners as mlechchhas—unqualified and unworthy—and on top of that, she was a woman, so from that conception she was even more unqualified and unworthy. There was one devotee, Akincana Krishna, a granddisciple of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, who had become a babaji at Radha-kunda. And because of his association with Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati—and he was also good friends with Bhurijana Prabhu and Jagattarini Mataji—he had some of that dynamic ISKCON spirit, Prabhupada spirit, and he wanted to renovate the whole bhajana-kutira, and Bhurijana Prabhu and Jagattarini arranged for Arca to paint the picture.

Arca and Kunti went to the unveiling of the painting on the disappearance day of three acharyas: Raghunatha dasa Gosvami, Raghunatha Bhatta Gosvami, and Krishnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami. But when someone pointed to her, and said, “There’s the artist right there,” she wanted to disappear into the earth.

Then Akincana Prabhu renovated Jiva Gosvami’s bhajana-kutira at Radha-kunda, and Arca also did the portrait of Jiva Gosvami. At the inauguration the head mahant at Radha-kunda surprised everyone and spoke openly about her: “This devotee has come all the way from South Africa, and she has done so many austerities to serve Krishna, and she painted this beautiful painting of Srila Jiva Gosvamipada,” and he actually started to weep when he was speaking about her.

So, Arca made many contributions in many different ways. But the main thing is that she gave her heart fully to service, to the service of the devotees, to Radha-Shyamasundara, and her consciousness became extremely elevated, and her destination was extremely auspicious.

Shortly after Arca left, I visited South Africa. I didn’t particularly expect anything different, but soon after I got there, I could feel her desire to give mercy to various devotees whom she knew, especially those who had been with her or had served her in some way. It was an adventure as she revealed to which devotees she wanted to show special favor. And the same process is continuing today.

We have many fond memories of Mother Arca-vigraha as we knew her, and we believe that she has gone to the realm of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Radha and Krishna and that she can bestow her blessings upon us. She is ready and eager to bestow her mercy upon her associates and friends, and upon the devotees whom she knew and appreciated when she was here. Her mercy is very strong and powerful, and I feel that we are very fortunate and blessed to have known her and to have had the opportunity to associate with her and to be able to receive her blessings even now.

Mother Arca-vigraha ki jaya!

 

Sundarananda dasa:

With Mother Arca-vigraha, the joy of being a devotee and her heart’s feelings for Krishna and the devotees were so alive. All her being, all her self, was full of life and her desire to serve Krishna and the devotees—just radiating this enormous desire to please Krishna, to serve Krishna, to serve the devotees and the spiritual master. It was like seeing everything we read put into practice. It was practically not seeing a human being but seeing a completely spiritual soul in action, in service to Krishna. I never saw her as a material body. Looking at her, I saw her service, her desire to please, her strong determined feelings for Krishna and guru and the devotees.

Hare Krishna.

 

Kandarpa Manjari dasi:

She has definitely been an inspiration in my spiritual life. The main inspiration was her service attitude toward you, Maharaja, and toward the other devotees. And her non-judgmental attitude toward the Vaishnavas—the way she was always willing to give the devotees the benefit of the doubt and encourage them—and her example of always being enthusiastic to serve were both very inspiring.

When I first arrived in South Africa in 1990, some of the devotees greeted me—Nama Chintamani, Kuntidevi—and they pointed out Mother Arca-vigraha, saying, “See Mother Arca-vigraha? She’s very advanced.” And of course, I, with my material vision, thought, “Really? Oh.” But as the years went by and I heard more about her, I realized why she was so advanced. I saw that in her different services in South Africa she was selfless—in her service to the Deities, the devotees, her spiritual master, everyone. I thought, “Oh, this is the real sign of advancement, that someone is willing to give up everything—one’s pride, everything—to serve.” Only then did I begin to realize what the devotees meant.

I finally met her when Maharaja was able to go to India after so many years. She and I were on the same flight back to South Africa. I had always wanted to speak with her, but I didn’t know how to approach her. But she just jumped out of her seat and came and sat right next to me and made me feel really important. She said, “Here, look at these pictures!” They were pictures of Maharaja and the life members in Bombay, and she took the time to explain each incident to me. Her enthusiasm overwhelmed me, and I thought, “This is such a kind-hearted devotee.” She just had an art of making you feel important, even though you weren’t. She was really amazing. It showed that even in her relationships she was selfless: she just wanted to encourage you all the time; she didn’t want anything for herself.

Then I went to Vrindavan. It was about five months before she left her body, and when I saw her I thought to myself that I didn’t know how to deal with her, because she was leaving her body, which is a very traumatic experience. But she must have read my mind or something, and she just walked up to me as if nothing was going on in her life except how much she was in love with Vrindavan. It was in the restaurant, and she hugged me and said, “You better come and see me before you leave”—really begging me to come. Unfortunately, I couldn’t fulfill that desire of hers, because we were in a rush to leave and were with a whole group of other devotees. I thought I would see her when I came back to Vrindavan, because I was planning to come back the following year.

When I heard that she had left her body, I felt very upset. But then I had a dream about her, at the same time that Maharaja came to South Africa after her disappearance. And in the dream we made peace and she forgave me that I had not come to see her.

Her example is my inspiration and example. When Maharaja was very sick and came to America in 1999, Mother Arca-vigraha was instrumental in helping me, because I used to pray to her to inspire me and help me to cook for Maharaja to make him feel better. She was a figure, an instrument, to instruct and help me, even though she was not physically present. And the same thing happened today. Although I have been very sick for the last few days and couldn’t even cook or do any housework, somehow I got up early and had energy to cook. This was definitely Mother Arca’s mercy, that on her auspicious disappearance day she again empowered me to serve the devotees. And I prayed to her that I could learn to become more selfless, like her.

Hare Krishna.

 

Kuntidevi dasi:

My mind is so filled with memories of Mother Arca-vigraha that it is difficult to isolate what inspired me about her, and what inspires me about her now. There is so much. But a few days ago, I was thinking how she embodied the two most important devotional principles: chanting the holy names and serving the Vaishnavas. As Kandarpa and Sundarananda have mentioned, she performed these two activities with great determination and enthusiasm.

She would get up early each morning, at about three o’clock, and she never failed to chant her sixteen rounds. She worked very hard. When she was painting the Deities in Vrindavan, she would hardly sleep for days or sometimes weeks. Even when we were still in South Africa, before we moved to India, she would paint until late at night. I would come back at about 10 p.m. from a day’s book distribution and the evening preaching program at Yeoville, ready to collapse. But Mother Arca-vigraha would be awake, so we would talk and discuss until late at night, sometimes reading from the Bhagavatam. The next morning, she would be up at three o’clock, ready to start another day. And although she would rise very early, she would often encourage me to take a little extra rest.

She always said that Jayananda Prabhu was her model. Hearing about his example inspired her with the determination to always finish her rounds, no matter what. She had such a taste for service that she often said she wanted to become like the Six Gosvamis. She lamented that she had to sleep at night. Once, we took a course in Vrindavan on The Nectar of Devotion and she said that the real nectar of devotion was to do service.

Her service to the devotees was amazing. She was everybody’s friend, and she made everybody feel important and special and loved. She would greet you in such a way that you would feel that you meant everything to her. One day, before I began to stay with her, I went to visit her at her house in Yeoville. I knocked on the door, and when she opened it, she exclaimed, “Oh, Kuntidevi!” with such joy. And I thought, “Wow, she really likes me.” Then, about an hour later, somebody else came and knocked, and when she opened the door, she greeted the person with the same joy and enthusiasm. I was quite shocked at first to realize that it wasn’t just me, but then I realized what a special quality it was to be so warm and gracious—and not just as a social mannerism, but from the love in the heart.

I miss her as a friend. She was the person in Krishna consciousness with whom I had the deepest friendship and the deepest relationship. I haven’t really had another friend like her. I really miss her a lot. I often share thoughts and experiences with her in my mind. Or something happens and I think of her—funny things, especially, because we used to laugh at the same things. And also confidential things, things I wouldn’t easily share with anyone else. And I would think, “Oh, Mother Arca would have laughed at this” or “I have to tell her this.” But she is not there in the same way anymore. Still, in another way she is still there and very supportive as a friend and as a devotee.

Although we were friends, Mother Arca-vigraha was older and more experienced. I learned a lot from her training, her instructions, and her association. I was telling Vrajesvari the other day how Mother Arca had a juicer that she received as a wedding gift, thirty years or so before I met her. Arca took such good care of this juicer that it was in first-class condition so many years later, even though she used it every single day.

This was one of the first practical lessons I learned from her—to immediately take the machine apart after every use, wash every piece, dry every part, put it together again, and pack it away. I learned how to take care of things and to perform even simple tasks thoroughly. This may not seem like a very profound lesson, but actually Srila Prabhupada said that Krishna consciousness means to be conscious, and she taught me to become more conscious of details.

Another thing I was remembering the other day—I was wrapping something—was how we used to wrap her paintings in Vrindavan. Again, she did it with such care and precision and artistry, the way she did everything. To maintain herself, she would paint floral still lifes, like the ones on the calendar in our kitchen. She was very, very sick at that time, and the pain in her arm was almost unbearable, but somehow she would still paint. So, I would go to different places in Vrindavan, sometimes in the fields, to collect flowers for her to paint. It wasn’t so easy to find flowers on stems in Vrindavan, because people there grow flowers mainly for garlands. So sometimes I would go to Delhi, to this really nice flower market at Khan Market, and I would pick out some beautiful flowers and bring them back to Vrindavan for her. We would arrange them in one of her colorful Rajasthani ceramic vases, and then she would just paint for days. It was a momentous effort every time. But she was so determined. Then we would have to package these paintings so that Sara, her daughter and agent in South Africa, could sell them. Mother Arca-vigraha was very particular about packing her paintings. By watching her and helping her, I got a sense of her meticulousness, and eventually I was entrusted with packing them. When a person who is such a perfectionist and who has such fine taste entrusts you with something so dear to them, it really means a lot. Of course, in some ways she entrusted her life to me, but at the time packing her paintings meant a lot to me.

Although I fall far short in every respect, I have often thought that my service to Mother Arca-vigraha prepared me for my service to you, Guru Maharaja, because you are also a perfectionist with very sensitive and refined taste, and you also have an artistic temperament in many ways. It was good training to serve her before trying to serve you.

Apart from being an amazing devotee, she was just a wonderful person. Nowadays we often speak about devotees being “balanced.” I feel she was balanced—as a human being and as a devotee—in the sense that she was very deep in spiritual life, very deeply absorbed in Krishna consciousness, but not fanatical at all, not dogmatic at all, not exclusive of anybody or anyone’s belief. She saw the essence in everybody and often said that we should see the divinity in everyone. And she had great respect for all living entities—even the dogs. When she saw the dogs suffering in Vrindavan, she would cry. Sometimes she would cry and say she was crying for the whole world. Of course, her emotions were heightened by her particular situation, but she was very sensitive.

She would befriend all kinds of devotees, even if they were unpopular or ostracized by some. For example, she made friends with Hamsaduta, who was considered very offensive, a renegade in ISKCON, but she made friends with him and welcomed him into her house. At first, I was really concerned. I could not understand why she made friends with him. I would go to Govinda Maharaja and ask him what we should do about her association with Hamsaduta, and I would write letters to Guru Maharaja asking him what to do. Eventually I realized that Mother Arca-vigraha was just following her own heart, so full of purity and spiritual realization. And this was another valuable lesson, to be true to oneself, the way Mother Arca-vigraha was always true to herself. She always followed her heart.

Mother Arca-vigraha was not conventional. Sometimes this was quite amusing, especially in the beginning. She was very spontaneous in her devotional service and lived “outside” in her own house, while we all lived in the temple and were all trained to be very, very strict about everything. There were so many rules and regulations, and the slightest “deviation” had tremendous consequences, or so it seemed at the time. But Mother Arca-vigraha was so spontaneous, and in the beginning she couldn’t get every detail right, like how many times to offer an incense stick or ghee lamp. Later on, I understood that the purpose of all the rules and regulations is to remember Krishna, and that Mother Arca-vigraha was already remembering Krishna, so what was the fault if she made some small mistakes.

And she always had a very personal relationship with Krishna. I remember that when I stayed with her in her house in Johannesburg, she would often talk to Krishna just like she would talk to any other person. And if something disturbed her, she would call out loud, “Krishna!” We weren’t quite sure how to understand her spontaneity, but her relationship with Krishna was indisputably real. Arca was twelve years old when her mother died, and she told me that her father was so grief-stricken that he was unable to take care of her and her older brother. So her father handed her over to the care of a Catholic lady, Mrs. Schneider, who lived next door. Although Arca was Jewish by birth, Mrs. Schneider taught her how to pray, how to call out to God, bowing down with folded hands, in the Christian way. Arca was in great distress about her mother’s death, but Mrs. Schneider taught her to take shelter of God. Mother Arca-vigraha credited Mrs. Schneider for teaching her to develop a personal relationship with God through prayer. And that sense of having a unique and personal relationship with God always stayed with her.

As she grew older, she explored many different paths of self-realization and God-realization. She inquired into Christianity, the Kabbalah, Sai Baba, Bhagavan Rajneesh, the Rosicrucians—everything there was. She even traveled on the back of a camel through the Sinai desert with a group of Bedouin nomads. And whatever path she followed, she learned everything there was to know about it and then practiced it very seriously. Gradually she rejected all the other theories and came to Krishna consciousness. Then she realized that Krishna consciousness was the process she had always been searching and yearning for. So when she joined and became a devotee, she already had a lot of spiritual training and realization.

But she was a fun person. Even when she was sick in India, dying, still she had a spirit of fun and adventure. At one stage we were going all over India, seeing different kinds of doctors and healers, going to different types of hospitals (I think I saw every cancer ward in Bombay and Delhi). But through all of this, which was a very heavy experience, she always had a sense of humor. Looking back on it now, I can see how incredible it was to maintain this spirit under such circumstances. But we saw it as an adventure, not only the physical adventure of traveling through India, but also a spiritual adventure, a journey. It was a very dynamic time. All these things would happen to us, and it was a great experience. We had some very unusual experiences.

One summer, when Mother Arca-vigraha’s frail health could no longer tolerate the intense heat in Vrindavan, we flew to northern India, to Kullu Manali in Himachal Pradesh. Kullu Manali is situated in the outer ranges of the Himalayas, near the border of Tibet, situated higher up in the valley, is a famous tourist resort, both for wealthy Indians and Western hippies. We chose to stay in the lower village of Kullu, situated on the banks of the river Vyasa.

Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhu in Vrindavan had given us the names of some friends in Kullu. One boy invited us to visit his family in their village, high on the slopes of the mountain. The only way to reach his village was on foot, a steep, three-hour climb from Kullu. There was no way Mother Arca could do such a climb, but she insisted I go. One morning the boy and I set out. The climb was magnificent, with beautiful vistas of the surrounding mountain peaks—named after the seven great sages—and the river below. The scenery and landscape reminded me of something one would see in a National Geographic photo-article. I knew Mother Arca would love it and resolved to take her as well.

First our friend offered to carry her on his back. Then he said he could take her on a mountain horse, but she was too frail for that too. Eventually we shelved the idea. But at nine o’clock the next morning our friend burst into our room and said, “Come, let’s go.” He had four other men with him, and they had crafted a special palanquin, or palki, for her, complete with curtains and a roof to shield her from the sun. For Rs. 500, they would carry her up and down the mountain.

Mother Arca-vigraha loved the palki and was excited about the climb. Not wanting to miss the beautiful scenery, she had us take down the curtain and the roof, and she made herself comfortable, sitting cross-legged, sketching. Although paid for their services, the palanquin bearers carried her with the utmost care and respect. She had that effect on people: everyone she met wanted to serve her and please her. And these people recognized her as someone special, a “holy mother.” Wherever we went around Kulu, people would offer respect and address her as “holy mother.”

Eventually we reached the village. First we visited the village temple, where there were a deity of Lord Ramachandra and a Shiva-lingam, and then the boy took us further up the mountain to his family home. His family lived in a simple log cabin—the sheep downstairs, the people upstairs—overlooking groves of almond and apple trees. Huge hemp bushes grew wild everywhere.

Mother Arca-vigraha was fascinated by the villagers’ simple, self-sufficient way of life. They grew their own wheat, dal, and vegetables; herded sheep for wool; and kept short-legged Himalayan cows for milk. They ground their own atta, spun and dyed their own wool, and wove their famous Kulu shawls and tunics. They even built their own houses. With the hemp they made shoes.

With usual Indian hospitality, the mother offered us lunch. She gathered bundles of wheat, ground them in a stone grinder, and with this freshly-ground atta formed thick rotis with her hands. Then she made a sabji of fresh, tiny eggplants with a chili-masala stuffing, and some dal. It was simple, almost primitive, but delicious.

After lunch, we drank fresh water from a stream trickling down the mountain. According to legend, the Pandavas, as well as many sages and rishis, had spent time in the area. It wasn’t difficult to imagine these great devotees living there, drinking fresh water from the streams, eating fruits and berries from the trees, and meditating on God.

Mother Arca-vigraha gained a lot of inspiration from that trip up the mountain. She saw it as a symbolic journey, looking out over the world she was leaving behind and embracing the world beyond.

Then one morning she woke up with intense pain. We knew the cancer had spread, and we returned to Delhi by bus—a fifteen-hour journey, winding down the narrow mountain roads. In Delhi we went straight to Batra Hospital to meet her oncologist, Dr. Gosh. He was very straightforward and told her that the cancer had come to a critical point. Mother Arca-vigraha was shaken. We both realized that she did not have long to live. The only thing she could do was try to control the pain through radiation therapy. So, we went back to Vrindavan for a few days and then returned to Delhi.

Mother Arca-vigraha wanted her art equipment—pencils and brushes and paints and papers—in case she felt inspired to work. We also took a portable kitchen—stoves, pots, and dry goods. And her special pillow, sheets, and personal effects.

The taxi left us at Batra Hospital. There were throngs of people. Struggling with our impossible luggage, we took our places in a long line leading to the front desk. Eventually we reached the admission clerk. Our idea was that I would stay under Arca’s bed and cook for her and take care of her. But the hospital refused. With that, Mother Arca-vigraha turned around and walked out. “We’re going to Kaya Maya.”

Years before, on a flight from Mauritius to Bombay, Mother Arca-vigraha had met a famous Ayurvedic kaviraja. After she moved to Vrindavan, she started taking treatment from Kaviraja Partap Chauhan, who, it turned out, was a student of the famous kaviraja she had met on the plane. And Kaviraj Chauhan’s “Guruji,” as he was called, ran an Ayurvedic clinic called Kaya Maya in Tughlakabad, outside Delhi.

We piled into an auto-rickshaw, with Mother Arca-vigraha in the back on top of the luggage, and I squeezed in next to the driver. When we arrived at Kaya Maya, we found that it was just a day clinic. Still, the manager agreed to give us a room, a dark little room full of cobwebs with a simple tap and toilet as an attached bathroom, and another room, a crude cement structure with a tap and a basin, to use as a kitchen.

Every day people would come to consult Guruji. They would wait for hours in the courtyard outside his consulting room, and they would notice us. Partly out of boredom and partly out of curiosity, people would come right up to our door and window and stare at us. And Mother Arca-vigraha, equally intrigued, would stare back. Her artist’s vision always noticed something unique and beautiful about each person, no matter how ordinary he or she seemed.

Mother Arca-vigraha had excellent taste in everything, and she loved fragrant oils. She had one particularly nice oil that she would wear on her sikha. So, the first night at Kaya Maya, at about ten or eleven at night, there was a loud knock on our door. Standing in the door, swaying and hiccuping, was a large man who introduced himself as Guruji’s son. He told us that he had just come from a party and had smelled the exquisite fragrance coming from our room. Mother Arca-vigraha was delighted and said, “Oh, you like it? Come smell.” So, she lifted up her sikha and allowed him to smell. Then he started telling us his life story, all the while hiccuping. As we got to know the place better, we understood that he was the black sheep in his family. But he felt so encouraged by Mother Arca-vigraha’s kindness. She always saw the good in everyone and gave them a sense of dignity and self-respect.

This was about six months before she left her body. She was very sick and in great pain. We had no transport to get to the hospital, so every day I would walk down to the main road to hitchhike. When a car stopped, I would tell the driver, “Just wait, I have to call my mother,” and run back up to call Arca. It is amazing how many austerities she accepted. She was accustomed to having the best of everything, but here she was, begging rides to go to the hospital.

At the hospital we met people from all over India and Nepal. Some had huge tumors, like footballs, protruding from their bodies. It was almost too much for the human mind to bear. I think the other patients recognized how brave Arca was. She was so obviously refined and accustomed to more, but here she was in a mediocre hospital, far away from her family and country and facilities. I think she gave the other patients courage to face their own situations.

After that, we returned to Vrindavan, and she never left again, not even for a day. She became more and more absorbed in Krishna consciousness, and her focus shifted from her life and service in this world to her life and service in Goloka Vrindavan. The next few months extracted from her the ultimate in surrender and purification, and by the time she passed away, her consciousness was highly exalted.

She had taken your instruction, Guru Maharaja—“Just go to Vrindavan and let Radharani take over”—completely to heart. Her faith in guru and Krishna and her love for Vrindavan had assured her of complete victory. There is no doubt that she entered the eternal pastimes of Radha and Krishna and Their associates.

[Talks on Mother Arca-vigraha’s disappearance day, May 9, 2000, Carpinteria, California]

One of the Saptadevalyas (seven ancient temples) of Vrindavan, Shri Gopinath Mandir was founded by Madhu Pandit whose glories are sung in the Bhakti Ratnakar. His Samadhi is found near the temple courtyard. 

Madhu Pandit was the disciple of Shri Gadadhar Goswami who came from Nabadwip to Vrindavan in search of Krishna. Here he started living under the tutelage of Shri Paramananda Bhattacharya.

Vrajanabha, Lord Krishna’s great-grandson, installed the original Gopinatha Deity in Vrindavana over five-thousand years ago.

There are two different accounts of the appearance of Shri Gopinath who was first worshipped at Vamsi Vat. According to one of them, He manifested to Paramananda Bhattacharya while the other talks of His appearance to Madhu Pandit who served the deity for 40 years in his hut. 

Later Raja Raesaal Shekhawat (Rae shilji) of Jaipur arranged for the construction of the present red sandstone temple for Him, sometime after Emperor Akbar’s Braj visit in 1573 AD. During Aurangzeb’s wrathful reign, the original Deity was moved to Jaipur and a Prati-bhuh murti was installed in its place.

Madhu Pandit Goswami blessed Shrinivasa Acharya with Gopinatha’s garland before Shrinivasa, Narottama, and Shyamananda took the bullock cart of Goswami granthas from Vrindavana. In Goloka Vrindavana, Madhu Pandit Goswami serves as Mandali-sakhi in the group of Champakalata-sakhi. 

There is one statement that says that whatever is written in the Vedas has to be taken as truth. Either you like it or you don’t like it. So I tried to understand in the Srila Bhaktivinoda Goswami’s statement and Srila Prabhupada in which take it literally and the other one, it’s not that important.

See, actually whatever is written has to be taken as truth. That is, there is a statement like that. At the same time, there is a clear understanding of context.

So for example, in the Bhagavad Gita itself, in 2.17, Krishna says, avinashita tad viddhi, that the soul cannot be destroyed. The soul is indestructible. And yet, in the same Bhagavad Gita, in the 16th chapter, 9th verse, 16th chapter, 21st verse, Krishna says that these things will destroy your soul.

etam drstim avashtabhyah nashtatmano alpabuddhaya This will destroy your soul. or trividham narkasyedam dvaram nashanam atmana So these will, these are soul destroyers. So now there is just no way both of these statements can be taken literally and they will be true.

So then we have to look at the bigger picture. So what is Krishna saying? That here, it’s non-literal. That Krishna is saying the soul’s spiritual tendency, the soul’s spiritual awareness, that will be destroyed.

So we have to look at the context. And that’s why, while shabda is the highest, but pratyaksha and anumana are also required. Jiva Goswami gives the example of Sandarbhas, that if somebody says that he lives, ganga abhyam graha, that his house is on the Ganga, then nobody can have his house on the Ganga, unless we are going to make a whole stretch of imagination and say this person is a mystic yogi who has built a house which floats on the Ganga.

This is a way to tell me to finish the class, no? So, the thing is that we have to use our intelligence. So pratyaksha and anumana, by pratyaksha, we know that there cannot be any house on the Ganga. Then it means it’s on the banks of the Ganga.

So we have to, Prabhupada said we have to make, we don’t want to do mental speculation, but philosophical speculation is required. So, there are clearly sections in the Bhagavatam, which are in the scriptures, which just cannot be taken literally. So, I would say it is, that’s why studying scripture requires faith, but it also requires intelligence.

And if it were only based on faith, just take it literally true, everything as it is, then why do we even need commentators? Just, this is it, that’s all there is. In fact, that is one of the big split between the Catholics and the Protestants. Some of the Protestants say that the scripture is self-evident, we don’t need any commentary.

But then when it’s self-evident, which part are you going to accept? Because even in the Bible also there are contradictory statements. So we need an approach. That’s why when we would say, whatever is said in scripture is true, that is true.

But there are two ways to approach. One is with faith, and the other is with intelligence. And both are important.

It is not only faith. If you have only faith, you can become fanatical. If we have only intelligence, we will become sceptical or even cynical.

So we don’t want to go in either directions. We want to have a balance of faith and intelligence.

The post When everything in The Vedas is said to be true, how can we interpret some Vedic statements to be non-literal? appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

🕉️ From Nightclubs to Nirvana: The Wild, True Story of Vrajakishor Das A rebellious Lithuanian teen. A flaming suitcase. A blue flute-playing god. Welcome to the spiritual rollercoaster you didn’t know you needed. 🚪 Chapter One: Smuggling Krishna Into the Soviet Union Before Vrajakishor Das ever said a single Hare Krishna, the seeds were already
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There are two cases in which the mind may trouble us. What are the cases? Yeah. Mind sometimes are paid and sometimes the mind isn’t paid. So it desires a moving piece.

So when the world is threatening us, that time will be comforting. Now when we are seeking things in the world, when we are creating control, power, pleasure, at that time also, the you can go to see the fortune. That time you control it. And then we discussed about comforting the mighty. How do we do that?

There was one metaphor I discussed yesterday, which I have throughout the session. What was that? The previous in the world. Yes. So you’re talking about if somebody is sick, they need to be aware of the gravity of the sickness, and they need to be aware of the competence of the doctor.

So if both are there, then they’ll take the disease seriously and take the treatment seriously, and they will be cured. And Krishna, the Bhagavad Gita assures Arjuna that do not fear. There’ll be no loss which is useful. So when you continue that theme today, do we have the box, What are the copies? Can you get it, please?

So We go to section, Anita. That is six thirty five where Arjuna says that this is very difficult to control, and how can I control it? So Yes. So do we have something lately? I’ll display it here also.

We’re going to see it here also. This is based on 6.34 where Arjuna is expressing the apprehension. So release me, oh god. We’re done with that. We’re done with that.

We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this.

We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this.

We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We’re done with this.

We’re done with this. We’re done with this. We from the mind that is restless, reasonless, ruthless, ruthless, and relentless. And we feel that we are very less to deal with the mind, and we know very less for the mind. So let’s recite this The mind is restless, reasonless, ruthless, and relentless.

The curve is so daunting as if a stormy wind, I will grasp it. As if a stormy wind, I will grasp it. So let’s look at this. Who would like to read this? You have a second.

Yes, please. My dear lord, the mind is, by its very nature, restless. When I try to focus on something, it wanders off to something else. How much of the life have I lost to distraction? My lord, please reveal to your supreme attractiveness and bring my restless mind to rest me.

Yes. So we’re going to discuss these four attributes of the mind one by one. So the first is that the mind is restless. This is a translation of the word. Chinchala is can be does not stay at oneness.

So normally, yesterday, I drew this functioning that there’s a soul, there’s the mind, and then there’s a form. So this is how we normally function. This for an organ functioning to happen, the soul, mind, and body need to be in one line. So for example, you are looking at me. I’m looking at you.

And so your eyes are focused on you. Your mind also has to focus on what I’m speaking or what I’m, writing. Similarly, if I see that what I’m saying is not comprehensive, I do attend to you so that I can make things clear. So the we see not just with our eyes, but we also see with our mood. So for example, when we are distracted.

Now distraction, what does it mean that the soul is here? The soul is here. The body is here. And the mind is here. So now what happens is from the soul, consciousness is the stream.

This color is a bit. Consciousness is like the stream that comes out from the soul. Just for example, if I is there echo? It’s going to be so if I consider this is my mic. It’s my phone.

It is a flash shot. So the source of the light, that is the soul. And now the view of light coming from the soul is consciousness. There’s atma, and there is. So now is the light still there?

Still there, but it’s not. It’s still there, but it’s not. Listen. Because it’s blocked. Now it’s risen.

So, basically, from the soul, when consciousness comes out, it comes out through the mind. And when the mind is distracted, what happens is the consciousness goes off with the mind. It doesn’t feel completely with the mind. It gets split. So maybe majority of the consciousness go this way, and little of the consciousness goes.

So for example, during the talk, the mind goes for a walk. If there’s some movement, the mind talks running like, hey. What is the joke? I also wanna do. So it’s not that it’s completely gone.

There’s a little bit of consciousness that is there, but often the consciousness gets split between the mind and the body. Sometimes when we are talking with people, you see their eyes are glazing. Earth do you earth do you come back? Which plan? Which plan are we going?

Which plan are we going? So this is absent mindedness of the stretch. So the mind is not where the ball was. So the mind is restless, and it just slips off so off. Now how why does the mind slip off?

Why do you think this is the mind of stress? Yes. Correct. Yes. It is true.

The mind is at stress because of two reasons. That the mind always do two things. It’s answered. They’re called as Sankalpa critical, accepting and checking. So normally speaking, the mind goes towards that which it feels is enjoyable, and it goes away.

It goes toward that is enjoyable. Something is enjoyable, it outward that. And if something is boring or the mind thinks it is boring, then the mind will refuse to go. Now sometimes, here, it come the dark and thick forceful light. It was a little bit clear in this dimension.

So quite often, the mind thinks that what we are normally dealing with is not so interesting. It may be important. It may even be interesting, but the mind has its own conceptions of what is interesting and what is not interest. That’s why the mind won’t absorb. Be sure its conceptions.

So it is restless because it has its own conception of what is attracting and not. And it’s well, if you wanna deal with the mind’s restlessness, the prayers that are the oldest, we want Krishna’s attractiveness. Then if Krishna reveals his attractiveness, then we get attracted and focus. So Krishna is attractive even now. But unfortunately, the mind does not find it.

And the reason for that is there are many difficulties in the mind. So we could use different examples for this. For the rest of this, the standard example is of a child. Yesterday, we talked about a child who’s caring. The mind is mother has to comfort the child.

But the mother tells child is a little struggle. And the child is around and starts to, mess of things. Mother has controls itself. The, the parents say, okay. You please you play, but play in our courtyard.

Don’t. And the child says, Then the restless mind the restless child has to occur. However, curbing is not enough. It is the responsibility of parents also trying to provide the child something interest to do So that not maybe you’re seeing a lot more years. So we do need to use force, but it is not just force.

It is also that we need to recognize that we have to provide something engaged. So bring to Krishna. Krishna, please. We will talk about Krishna. But broadly speaking, when the mind is less, it has to be refocused.

And this is the first problem in the mind which irritable experiences. And now the problem with the greed can actually become worse and worse. So the problematic mind that the mind is restless is a problem, but we could say it is the least of the problems posed by to be distracted is bad. But beyond that, Krishna says this, means it’s mad. It’s irrational.

The way I put it here is it’s remonseless. Oh, any of the ladies who like to move this? Do we have monk? The white is also Yes. You can stop So, basically, as I said, restlessness is a problem.

But sometimes, if, say, somebody who’s a little older, they’re fiddling around. They’re maybe fiddling. It’s a important session. We need to focus on this. Pay attention.

Now sometimes it can reason the children. Sometimes it’s very difficult to reason the children. One of the aspects of raising children has been grow is that initially, you may have been struck. They said, I do this and do this, but they actually as they grow up to go to reason that because they are also developing their intelligence. And their intelligence may be immature right now.

They may not go to see things the way we see things. But still, we need to reason with them. And sometimes it’s very frustrating when the person is just not reasonable. We are trying to make a a reasonable case. Okay.

This you can do this later. But it just is not not less. And dealing with other reasonable people becomes difficult if not impossible. So the mind’s second problem is that it can be reasonless. Now what does reasonless mean?

That restlessness is fickle, but reasonless is, say, if if a student if a student would call him, stay in the hospital. And somebody comes and says, let’s go watch TV. Yeah. Let’s go watch TV. What’s on there?

Friend is this. So what it means is, generally, one way to reason. Reasoning has many aspects to it. But one aspect of this thing is to show the relationship between choices and consequences. Many times when the mind is fickle, it just not realize the gravity of the choices moving.

So sometimes we need to reason with the word. Okay. You don’t want to know this right now. This is important. They we all in in a class, Suddenly, our phone needs to start looking at the class.

Well, that’s a little distracting, but if you’re driving in a crowded home in the school area, and there are four weeks to start looking at the that when the kid comes along the way, The consequence could be disastrous. So when generally, reasoning involves two things. She providing children that deal between choices and consequences. That’s one has many aspects. But then how a particular choice will lead to particular consequence.

Showing that is a. And the second is showing the stakes. What is that stake over it? Okay? This consequence cannot land.

If I don’t do any of this to examine, what was the big deal? Are you himself here? So the choice is see the link between the causality and the because the choice and consequences is the principle of causality. That causes will lead to results, and stakes are the costs. What is going to happen?

How this will lead to this? Many times we explain, it becomes possible. Say, if somebody says, I I just can’t be operated. Values are changing quite a bit in America. One Day only.

It is about show shift, from a movie made in So that day? That it is that it is as weird as being a communist or at that time being a homosexual. It’s completely new, but now values have changed. I think the reasons are there. Health reasons are there.

Ecological reasons are there. So the point is somebody say, I just can’t give a mood. I just need to eat it. But then since then, suppose they had a money back. And the doctor says, if you don’t give up meat, then life will give you all.

Oh, what is this? Just forget it. I like meat, but I like living much more. So sometimes when we realize what’s in stake, when you’re in the forceful way, then it they said no. But there are times when the mind becomes so detached that the reasoning just does not see that so that is there is this whole phenomena called addiction.

Now addiction, nowadays, it is very casually used that that is, oh, I’m addicted to my phone or my child is addicted to the screen. And, yes, we could use it in that way. That that’s a nontechnical way of using it. More technical way of using the word leaderships that at one level, that three season addiction, that there is a craving. Not just a craving, but there’s a constant craving.

I don’t know what I do. I do it. I do it. I do it. There’s something inside.

Do it. Do it. Do it. Do it. Now we may have craving for many things, but there is, with respect to this, control.

There is lack of control. Now all of us may crave for many things. We may crave to eat delicious food, but many of us will not go and rob a house to eat, rob a house, I will shop to eat. If not, there is somebody else in India to speak for their meal. We all have a sense of what is.

So what happens is there is the collapse of control. Then there’s a collapse of control. So generally speaking, everybody has a sense of boundaries in their life. You all may get angry, but when we get angry, we may yell at someone. We may use some swear words.

Each of these are words, it’s probably the knife, some of the medium correction. But most people don’t know that. So when there’s a reaction, there is a collapse of conflict. And then so creating is the first feature, the collapse of primordial selection feature, and the third feature is associate with consequences. That there is there is continuation in spite of consequences.

Continuation in spite of consequences. Even when a person suffers from the hostel, somebody drinks a lot, and when they drink, they they suffer when they they get some trouble to see them back in the hospital. The doctor says, if you don’t stop drinking, you’ll die. And the person’s, like, you said, I have. At least, they die happy.

So what happens over here is these three, basically, are the characteristics where something has become a. There is clearly we stand. We don’t have any peace of mind. Think of anything. So to put it diagrammatically, we consider that there is the soul, there is the mind, there is the body.

And say there is the world out here. So soul, mind, body, and world. So now craving is like an impression in the mind. This is this is craving. So we all have experienced grieving at that.

It just strips our peace of mind. It’s just it’s all we feel as if we are being tormented from within. Now when there’s collapse of control, we may create for many things, but then when there is action, when things go from the level of the mind to the level of the body in terms of action, that is where there is a collapse. The latency, somebody is alcoholic. Many people may drink when the middle is okay in a party in the end of the day and lead time.

Even among people who drink, if somebody starts to be right early in the morning or then you need they need to order to drink. Yeah. After that, so there’s a collapse of control. So the person it it goes from the mental level to the physical level. Now sometimes we can get away with whatever we do, but sometimes what happens is from the world, there are consequences that come up on us.

From the world, consequences come upon us. At even though the consequences come, the consequences can be severe. The consequences can get hit the body. The consequences can hit the mind also. But in spite of that, the continuation is still continuing.

So then the consequences, they don’t have an impact. Continuation in spite of consequences. Consequences are neglect. Like, some people, what they do is they get caught and they get in trouble. They think that, oh, you know, last time I just didn’t do it right.

No. There’s no need to know doing certain things. You just destroy it. So the mind can sometimes go on reasons. Reason lessons where the creative is very strong, then the indulgence in the physical level happens.

And even if you get into trouble, still you wanna have it forget. You don’t have to list. So almost like we have selective ambition. When we forget the trouble we got into previous, we keep in touch. So this is where the mind becomes underneath.

And now what do we do with such things? It is it is our own mechanism just does not work. So we have to pray to Krishna Krishna. You help me. You help my mind to see some reason.

Sometimes that reason may just come the most serious consequences. Sometimes somebody use a very serious analysis and it’s like this. So somehow, it we are very sure that that my listening faculty activates, and then I can see this. So this is where the mind becomes from reasonness. It’s coming.

Okay. See, I’m using a minimalist model over here. Minimalist model means what? At the three levels of existence. The so the soul, mind, and both.

Now I could go into intelligence. It’s like I yesterday, I used the example of the they use the example of solely, like, the if you consider computer system, the solely that the user, the body and the hardware, the mind and the soft. Now at the software level, you can have a virus. At the software level, you can have essential programs. At the software level, you can also have antivirus.

So the viruses, if you consider, the subtle level, where there are at the subtle level, there’s the mind looking. Naha. I’m just using the word short line mind because Krishna uses many places. Krishna says elevate yourself with your mind. Don’t kill yourself.

Krishna now says elevate yourself or elevate your mind with your intelligence. Don’t let your mind be degraded by your mind. He’s just using me and me and my mind. So I’m keeping it simple. So in the subtle mind, there is it’s like if you consider mind to be the software.

Let me put software. Doesn’t matter if you have software. So within the software, there would be the software that is on a positive side. There is essential software. We need for our function.

Any device for function needs essential software. Then there is protective software. And then there is there is dangerous software. These are more like viruses. So dangerous software are viruses.

And what it will be the antivirus. So now all of these, at one level, are software. Is it all of this is software? So like that, there are impurities. There are clambas.

These are like the negative of slanting harness. Now for our essential machine, we all have learned a lot of tricks. You could call it intelligence, but it is more than intelligence. It is it is what is intelligence, but it is something that’s not so deeply inside us. You could call it as both of these are intelligence.

They’re all software only, but there is there is something called instinctive intelligence. Instinctive intelligence means if my hand touches fire. I’m gonna consciously think of my intelligence immediately the hand itself. So for all of us, we there are many areas where we do the right thing without necessarily needing to think about it. So that’s instantaneous.

That that that there’s a big program that is necessary for function for us. If we come into a room that is dark, light is turned on. The light is very clear. Immediately our eyes are open. Don’t think about it.

So instinctively is there. And then there is there is a reflective intelligence. Now when you talk about developing our intelligence, it can look for both of these. The reflective intelligence as well as the the inputs institutes. So, basically, all of these are the subtle and softwares.

So I hope it’s sufficiently complicated. K? So now now, the mind can mean this. I don’t know what reason is. Let’s move the third part of the mind.

And after that is let’s go ahead. Beyond that, my lord. Would you like to read any other mantras? Yes, please. So mind can be merciless.

A lot of. So what do we mean that in the, mind can be merciless? There’s, I have a friend in Australia. He’s a emergency doctor. So once I have time, he And then it didn’t expect a nothing was working.

It just ended so much. The entire element cannot work. So now, there is some pleasure needed. But after some time, what happens is there is no pleasure at all, but still it’s as if we are held by something and forced to do something. We don’t even want to do it, and we keep doing it again and again.

Initially, you will say whenever we indulge or Somebody eats a lot, something drinks. There is some pleasure. But the pleasure has a diminishing returns. Like, we’ve asked for some time, the pleasure disappears. This is a it’s a very important point to understand in learning to fight the mind that if you consider when there is indulgence.

And indulgence means when we indulge in some activity, we train, we eat. Now initially, there is some pleasure. Sometimes the indulgence does not give us pleasure. All it gives us is relief. That means pleasure means doing it makes me happy.

The relief means not doing it keeps me unhappy or keeps me in doubt. It’s not that doing it makes me happy. It’s just that not doing it makes me so miserable that I have to. So this way, even when the pleasure stops, still it’s remain, it’s keep doing it. So this is where so are we talking about addiction?

This is where the consequences are coming. It’s not in the consequences that come in the future. Consequences have come, but still, it seems as if something inside us is holding the link like this. So, actually, this is the scared part of the mind. The rest of us is annoying.

It’s failing. This is when the mind becomes scared. Of course, the mind is not vulnerable like this. In some areas, especially when the attachments are strong and you’re gonna do that a lot, the mind can be doing these things. So let’s look at the last part and then we’ll get the solution.

Yeah. And then my dog might be the lectures. Even if I see no words to positions again in me, they keep coming. Like, waves in the ocean, Yes. It’s a I’m not saying okay.

It’s like some there are some things you want to do now, like, it’s like one and done. I do it once I have it. Some indulgences just keep coming again and again and again. There’s a British, playwright, Oscar Wilde. He said that getting up smoking is the easiest thing in the world.

I have done it over a hundred. I mean, so I gave okay. But smoking not giving up. So it’s like, we use the key. Come on.

Keep. Come on. Again and again. Somebody fight the battle and say, no. I lost this battle.

There’s only another battle. There’s only another battle. So now what do we do? Only you can get my money here. Okay.

We’ll just discuss solution. Last part, we’ll let you be. Yes. Yes, please. I it’s not the temptation.

Yes. So now when the mind is relentless in this way, it is it’s extremely difficult to actually deal with it. Thankfully, while it is the end, what do we do for dealing with the mind? I’ll just ask this question, and Krishna will answer the next words. And that’s where I was talking about something yesterday.

I talked about having the doctor patient needs to understand that this is seriously, and then they’ll bring the cure seriously. So what is the cure over here? Yes. We need to control the mood, but it is not just control the mind. Basically, for us, when the mind wants to go in a particular direction, and we know this, the push it in some other direction.

So in spiritual growth in total management, there are two principles for us. There is the push principle, and there is the pull principle. So there can be no push, which is the negative side of the x axis, and no pull. Maybe the negative side of the other y axis. So push is be from our side are trying to direct the mind in an energy direction.

It is that God helps those who help themselves. The door to change can only be opened from inside. If somebody doesn’t want to change, only can help. So the push principle is very important from our side to to make influence. So what is the input that we make?

That’s the mind is basically like a machine. It is an academy. It’s a software. So it’s a mess goes off and bring it back, goes off, bring it back, goes off and bring it back. It’s simple programming of the mind.

So when we keep bringing it back, the mind is just programmed. So last year, I had to mind taking this exam that is we did for this. Have any of you heard of this small thing in India? So now suppose somebody has visited a website called polygon.com. Now maybe they visited 10 times, 20 times, and they come for a spiritual talk like this.

And then they hear about the Bhagavad Gita. When they hear all the Bhagavad Gita’s scale, Google and Google and Google Bhagavad Gita. They open their browser and start typing the you know what happens? Pollywood. Pollywood comes.

Pollywood. Now why is that coming? It’s frequently listed. Yeah. Because it’s stored in the history.

Now the device in the software is not against us. Can you do this? Maybe this is what you want to do and make it easier. But in this case, all that needs to be done is just focus on typing a given Gita. And this typing the all the 12 letters It seemed like typing all the rest.

Just just press enter. It’s gone. So for some people, they type b and then volume.com comes. For some people, volume.com is not just auto complete, that is their home page. So but then in the state where somebody adding trash to the makeup, that’s what comes in there.

We had more come to that. That’s coming there. But all it needs to be done is just visiting, say, bhagul.com. If someone keeps visiting, gradually, what happens? That will be so good in the history.

In future, we’ll time be, but we cannot come also. So there is when you wanna wanna control the mind, there is there are two things to it. One is reprogramming the mind. Now reprogramming is our human endeavor, and this is what we need to do. We need to keep okay.

Mine goes off, bring it back. Goes off, bring it back. And you say, what is the use? It will even if I bring it back, it will go. Doesn’t matter.

The point is that each time you bring it back, a new bridge is great. Each time there is a new logo there on the call, a record is made in the browser history. The reprogramming is one aspect of it. The other is the reformatting. Now reformatting means just delete the browser.

Reformat the complete device. We delete the browser history, whatever it is. Basically, we have removed from history. There is no format button for our heart. At least there’s no button in our hands.

This is where divine grace comes. By the mercy of Krishna, he can format our mind. When he formats our mind, then what happens is, so you don’t think they just not come. Out. That is where the mercy factor comes.

And Krishna later in the fifteenth chapter says, I want you to remember this knowledge and forgetfulness. Now how does Krishna remember this knowledge and forgetfulness? It ultimately depends on our desire. So I’ll do points here and I’ll do this. How is that?

What point over here? See, push is basically we are trying to reprogram. It’s a reprogram the mind. Reprogram means keep doing the same thing again and again and again. That is what we need to do again.

That is important. And it can lead to change also. It’s not that it is of, and it is other person. It is important to us, and this is where sometimes we devalue small steps. Sometimes we think that one of my friends was in India.

He said in January, he was in India. He said that he’s from America, and he said, I had to go back to America by Feb. He’d come on vacation. He says, then in special Feb, he says, in Feb, my business is very good. I said to him, what is your business?

So he said he was a therapist. He said, okay. What about what is therapy? His business got to Feb. So he said that in jab and the emails comes, people make a lot of new resolutions.

And the secret was sometimes for one week, two week, three weeks. By the time fed comes, they failed in most of their resolutions, and they become depressed. And that’s where they so now what happens with this strategy is your risk, but it’s tragic also. The point is that many times when we make a resolution, we think if I can’t if I have failed to stick to the resolution, I have failed. But but see, can you stop for stuck with for one week?

You stuck with for one month. That’s a good thing. That much new programming has happened in the mind, and that is a valuable thing. That’s why especially if there are behaviors which we are not doing change for a lot, don’t try to make a resolution. I will never do this again for the rest of life.

And the mind will say so you have the rest of your life to stick to that resume. It does right collapse. So just make a time zone resolutions. Because what happens is if you make a long resolution, then there is no success in that. There’s only the fear of.

Even if you stick to a resolution of three sixty five days, on the three sixty six days, we remember labs, all of you die. You look at what we deal for three sixty five days. So the key in this push part is that again. So in the push part, the key is that don’t be value. Small, simple steps.

This is a very practical principle, but we often just neglect making changes because I have not understood it. It’s a matter of a mistake. Even if you don’t stick the change, some part of that change will stick to us. That will be there inside us as a. For some people, changes are getting easy.

Say, for example, somebody has visited bollywood.com 10 times, and they visit bollywood.com 10 times, then that is said that earlier might not come as complete. For somebody, they may have visited Bollywood.com 10 thousand times. And then visit it in ten ten by not beginning to. But it’s still making me dead. It’s just not a blessing.

So don’t defend it. Just keep doing it. Keep doing what we do is good. So this is the push principle. The follow-up, all of it by the push and pull out the stupid principles.

The push principle is something which we need to do to show Krishna that I have the fullness. He said Krishna want to reformat the brain, reformat the mind. Unless he sees that he want to format. So, Krishna, so the second part is where we can see how the whole principle works. The whole principle is that Krishna says, I am the giver of three things.

What is this? Remembrance. Krishna says, I give you remembrance. I also give you forgetfulness. And Krishna says, I give knowledge.

So suppose somebody has been drunk a lot, and they had a terrible hangover. And the next day, they go to party and they’ll see drink. Now they can remember the hangover and say, no. I don’t want drink. Or they can remember the high they had over the lower side.

Yeah. I wanna drink. So what we remember and what we forget, we’ll determine what choices we make. So for all of us, quite often that these are almost automatic sense of memory bubble up its size. And certain memories just don’t so what this is Krishna give remembrance and, forgetfulness is dependent on our desires.

But it is not just our desires. Now desires can themselves be into categories. That is what we want It’s important. No doubt. But there is also what we want to want.

What we want to want. K. What I want is there’s one of them. I wanna look at something on that one. I want to go on this.

K. I have to focus. I would have done some of these new things. I’m learning new skill. I wouldn’t be.

So for all of us, desires also. If if we can be what I want to want as stronger, could I see that? It may not be that. All the time is a little stronger. Krishna is Krishna.

So what does beautification mean? This push and pull principle is see, this is the earth, and there is some small object over here. Just trying to escape that gravity pull of the earth. Maybe there’s some kind of a rocket that’s going out. Now there is the gravity pull of the earth, which will keep it inside.

This is the earth as the. And if it has to go, there’s a lot of pushing. Without that, it not work. Now suppose there is an object. So this is the birth.

Let’s put it this way. This is the earth, and this is its gravity. And say, this is some celestial object. There’s some celestial object, and it has it described. Now if an object comes over here, and what will happen is if an object comes over here, then it will experience a pull.

And that pull will draw the object. So now this is the two different types. So if there are certain areas where the push is pulling and getting it down. No. It pulled down, so we need a push shift.

But there are certain areas where the pull, it pulls in particular direction. So for example, this is some kind of Maya. This is some kind of temptation. There’s some kind of things that drives us up. This is Krishna.

So we all find that there are certain areas where Krishna also is about an alcoholic, and they wanna give a check. They say, I have a job at the bar, on my house right next to a bar. And then we know bar for them to go to the bar. So what happens is that they’re already putting themselves in the gravity. But suppose somebody comes to spiritual days, somebody comes to ten minutes, when it comes to wheels where there are people who are all trying to move by hand and symbols.

What happens is they feel. So Krishna is the ultimate exerciser. And while these two are the still pieces fortunate for us, if you forget everything, you’ll just remember this image of precision. Then this is the Earth. This is the Earth’s gravity pull.

There are places in the world where Krishna comes so close that Krishna’s gravity pull is felt even when we are the earth has not become. So this is the places where the where Krishna’s gravity pull, that means Krishna’s mercy is visible at various places. When that happens, then okay. There is we need to push from our side, but there is also a pull from above. And the push from outside and the pull from above, both of these, they mentioned again the store.

And then they experience the pull. Then after that, if there is the effort just quickly disappears. Certain attachment is just fall off. So we will need to control the mind, but our focus is not to control. It is controlling the mind often.

We may come one place where it’s just so sublime. Let me not do let me forget. Yes. There is a there are places if we go to where we come to a place, it’s very. Much of the agitation of the mind disappears.

So for us, the more we can put ourselves in the granting perfection, and remember Krishna. So what does remember Krishna mean? It is by trying to remember Krishna, by trying to invoke by trying to evoke Krishna’s presence. So it’s what we’re trying to do is we’re trying to put ourselves in Krishna’s hierarchy. They put us in Krishna’s that’s when the meeting is.

That’s the time when the middle water stops. That’s the time when we get so much clarity and so much focus. That’s the time. Even if one of our attachments, one of our discoveries, we will find that each one of us will be able to focus so much more everything that we do. Most of us, like, is not the machine.

It’s like saying, we are trying to drive away in a particular direction, And it’s like there is a huge boulder stuck to us. And the boulder stopping us, most of the time, we are maybe if our force is hundred, the boulders force 90, and then most of us may be up to 10%. So much of our consciousness is dissipated in the mind being restless, relentless, resentlessness. Of course, sometimes it happens that our forces will break, and the mind’s force is 300. And then we end up going in the opposite direction we want.

But all of us, we all achieve something in our life. It’s matter to see the opposite. If imagine at work we had 10% of our own capacity, we have achieved so much. If the inner opposition, say, decreased from 90 and became 10, Then how much more each one of us will be doing in every area of our life? That is the issue that Krishna offers.

That is the opportunity. It is there for each one of us. Similar things where I discussed during, all my mind. So with analytic, but I assume support mind that you need to do a new problem, what happens to us. So we talked about today controlling the mind.

What do you mean? Now why do we need to control the mind? We talked about the thought. The problem was in terms of four hours. What are the four hours in remembrance?

What are the first? Restless. So restless means that the soul is here, the body is here, but the mind has gone somewhere else. That is the mind is then after that was reasonless. Normally, whenever we tell either the the causality, and this will lead to this, or we tell the costs.

The mind listens, but sometimes it just isn’t. Now maybe the reason is, everybody has service as a bottleneck. If I do something terrible, but it’s enough. I mean, sometimes people go work gambling. They take some money with them, and they spend all the money.

But sometimes they gamble only what they, they take out the other bag and they put their house on board mortgage. So it is what happens is it is ruthless. Homeless means it does not spare anything at all, and that’s where it did come straight in the last words. Relentless. It does not just happens one time, but it happens again and again to be.

So here we discussed three characters of addiction. What are the characteristics? Three c’s? What are the first main members? Creating.

The craving is it is a consuming craving. It is a yeah. Overpowering craving. And then it’s constant overpowering craving. And the second was yeah, collapse the control is just completely lost.

So there is and everybody has may have craving, but craving can be at the level of the mind. But can do collapse and control because there’s physical intentions. The third was consequences. But even when there are consequences, still what happens? One doesn’t care.

There’s continuation in spite of consequences. And this is where the mind doesn’t just remain distracting. It becomes destructive. And this is a deadly state again. And then we discussed the meaning of this.

We talked about two parts. One was the push pins. The for the push item, the exams a lot. This is like the reprogramming in the pipe. Just keep doing the right thing.

Here, the exam number was more of the software itself. Software don’t devalue small steps. Every single change that we do that has an impact. Even if it doesn’t seem to have an impact. If we make a resolution, we stick to it for one week, that’s a good thing.

That is first part. And the other was the full principle. Full principle means that this is, like, reformatting the mind. Just delete all the past impressions, and this happens by Krishna’s mercy. When we remember Krishna, we are in Mughal’s presence.

So push is like if this is the Earth, the Earth has its gravity too. And if we are on the Earth, then we exert the push from our side. And then there is Krishna love us, and there is Krishna’s gravity pull, which can actually lift us up all the way. So we’ll become Krishna’s force. Each one of us will actually find a miraculous change, but this little battle ceases.

And each one of us, we will find that whereas in the past, we might have been functioning with a significant opposition. You wanna go one way, and something inside us wants to go another way. We’ll find that when you become beautified, the inner opposition will become much lesser. In each one of us, we’ll find that we’ll become more clear, confident, or but also available. My dear lord, please guide me.

I I just offer the bread and the offer. Dear lord, please let me understand how dangerous the mind can be. Help me remember the times when it has been restless or recently less or ruthless or relentless. Let me take this in me series. Kind of meet my hope, my lord.

You can help me completely change my mind if I just show you that I want my change my mind. And this control of this way, it could be done to me. My dear lord My dear lord. Even when I feel Feel what when I’m saying? I that I can’t control my mind.

I got I’m sorry. Let me remember that you can do what my can do. Alright. If I just show you I just show you. The desire The desire.

Daughter. Any quick questions or moments? Yeah. I have a problem with the other questions or comment. Thank you so much for coming in.

Thank you, Madhaj. The question is So, see, the Bhagavathons has a good for a minute, but if we take each other out of Krishna’s note of speak, then our vast ocean becomes as small as the water contained in the middle of the field of a calf. So what is it that which is impossible for us that becomes possible, Panch? Yes. It is that’s why I think the line you are being discouraged.

But if we use our power as a means to show Christian, call upon Christian to intervene with this forward. There is a very reason for us to move. Right. The question is in the same chapter, Krishna talks about once it That different I’ll talk about two ways to understand that it. Just look at this.

See, one has practice the human soft, for example. The word practice sometimes may not convey the point of it. What does it be? It actually persists. We need to persist in what we are doing.

We’re going back to the going back to the, software, but then just keep this in the middle of the call. And then detachment. Now detachment, again, it seems to be in emotion. I I can’t be that right. What do I do?

So that means abstinence. So abstinence means just don’t visit Bollywood. So now if we keep visiting the right side, don’t keep visiting the wrong zone. What happens? That eventually, we will come to the level of transcendence to both of these.

So the mind will change those persistence and absence together with these transmittance. That’s why I think that act. Maybe there’s an act way to transcend it. It gets shown on the mind’s pulse. Just persistence.

Transcend. Abstinence. Now we another way to understand Abias and Veda case is similar to the push mode principle only. But for all of us, there are boundaries which we need to set up, and there are bonds which we use. So boundaries means what I want.

So boundaries is broadly something to help us assist in abstinence. That means if somebody says that I’m I’m not on a recall path. Then they had to create some physical bond. Don’t stay at a call bar. If somebody said, I don’t wanna use my device so much.

I don’t wanna spend so much time social media. Maybe you just block some apps. I mean, the regular have something to that. We’re not allowed to spend so so much time. So we don’t have to rely all the time moving forward.

We can create some more. And similarly for persistence, we can create some points. So persistence means that if we decide that, I want to send the. That’s a good thing. But you say if you join some online news where there is we are paying some money, we’re committing ourselves.

They say in one year, I’ll complete this. So we can make a financial bond. We can make a social bond. I joined this course and I’ll be in one year. So we create some kind of bond for us.

We make it easier for us to persist. So if you want to do our more meditations, then you know, do our meditations every day in the morning or, on the channeling, then maybe, you know, have some kind of a online group. If you can’t meet physically or chanting, meet digitally. At least for some time and do the ones who are chanting together. That’s a command.

Or we have one side group where we share with each other what time we did our chanting. Or if you want to read the. Now maybe just fix the time when two people come together and read together for a few minutes. I’ve seen I know one girl. Where is it to be?

I’m Travis also. They said that this way, they read the Bhagavat, the minimum of fifteen months. And they within within two years, they completed the entire Bhagavat. They didn’t discuss it too. Just read it.

So they they would see all the purpose of that simple person doing this. So that is just a little more. So bonds and bonds are very helpful in helping the aim and sharing that the transform of the mind becomes easier. So now another way to connect the toppings, the boundaries, and what our mind may tend to go outside the boundaries. So stay within because stay within the boundaries, we need to push ourselves.

Don’t do our or the push now is the outward. We had to push ourselves to stay within the boundaries. And through the bonds, this is where we can invoke the world. It’s not that the will come automatically, but we can invoke the push, bring the earth to Krishna’s presence and Krishna to us. So that’s how we can improve that.

K? Thank you. Can you ask if stop? Yes. It is.

So See, because not the monopoly of any particular tradition. Nor does nor is God’s message available only through a particular book. Through certain books, we may get more clarity. Through certain traditions, we may have certain resources, which we we may find more beneficial than others. At the same time, one element to reality calls us in different it provides different parts.

So in every tradition, there’s some understanding that there is something like a inner entity. So in the Christian tradition, there is the idea of system. In the Islamic tradition, there is. In Star Wars, there’s a dark force on the dark side. Even in even in what you call as a fiction, that is there.

See, nowadays, I think people say that I have got other deals. No. They do not believe in people. They believe in their deals. It likes the fact is, we may or may not believe in Krishna, but we cannot go through life for a long time without coming to believe in Maya.

We may not use the word Maya, but that there is something inside me that works against that is something that everyone realizes. It’s actually most of the world. This was actually one of the reasons what what is spirituality. Is that if you consider the path of life, we all want there are certain doors. If they open, then on then the door is open, then we can have better and better life.

So those could be in education, employment, migration, whatever. We all want to we want the doors to be open so that we can have a better life. And that is important, and that is what most people focus on. But, actually, this is what my personal, so I have fun studying, achieve a lot. I did not really feel an interest in power and well, when I talk to education, I go to kids and not make them make sense for discovery, but share with others and help others.

But since my childhood, I had a bit of a temper. I had a bad level of slight problem, But I had another problem, which did not feel like a book. Since which I don’t I had a lot of interesting words. So one of my hobbies, I just pick up a word and pick up a dictionary, memorizing words. So I had a good vocabulary.

And as you get amazed, that a bad tempo and a good vocabulary is a technical competition. Also articulated, now they can just be so sarcastic. They can cut. They can actually cause more that will ask of. So we see somehow this picture formed in the night.

Like, you know, if there are they’re going along the path of life, there are also trapped doors. And we can just fall in those terms. So this just as it’s important to open these doors, it’s just as important to close the trapdoors. So, most of us, we may or may not believe that there is a God, but we all stumble on some trapdoor in the wall. There’s something inside which is dragging it down.

And at that time, we just start thinking about, is there a speed like that? Is there something bigger that can help you to fight against this? So I’m coming back to the same thing that, you know, there’s a take the decision seriously and take that in your sense. So for us, there is something bigger than me, which is inside, which is working against me, which seems to be out of this. And the question is, will I become big enough to fight against the devil coming?

Or is there something bigger than this which I can connect with? And by that, I can. So if we can initiate this idea that we have inner demons. That that is there. That’s just a part of universal human wisdom.

But then, okay, to combat these inner demons, are they? Is there a inner divinity? Is there a divinity that we need to do? So I would say the specifics may not be there in various traditions, but the broad principles of the need to fight against the inner demons and take and and take a course of some limited that can help us to fight against. That is very much.

Okay. So thank you very much for your proper questions and for your participation. Stay in and me.

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Hare Krishna. So today, we’re continuing this discussion on the topic of the punishments in hell. How many of you were there yesterday? Okay. How many of you were not there yesterday?

Okay. How many of you are not there today? Okay. So I’ll do a quick recap of what I discussed yesterday, and we’ll move forward from there. Broadly, discuss the topic was how do we reconcile the idea of a loving god with such brutal punishments in hell that I described over here.

And I talked about how within the tradition itself, there is a contextual emphasis or contextual presentation. I talked about how Mahaprabhu said there’s no need for Vedanta Sutra commentary, but Bal Devidya Avushan recognized that there is an absolute need for the commentary. So that depending on the sensibilities or the concerns of particular people at particular times in history, the Acharya has to reach out to contemporary teachers, contemporary people. And so each generation is presented here by circle. So Bhaktivinath Thakur was the Acharya who had to who focused on tackling modernity.

And we discussed our challenges in presenting the message of the Bhagavatam and one of the aspects is this cosmology. And there I talked about how the principle he says, Srila Prabhupada and Bhaktina Thakur had discussed their approaches and I would like to elaborate on that today a little bit. So Bhaktivirath Thakur used a somewhat non literal reading. And Srila Prabhupada, if you see, there’s a non emphasis. I’ll come back to he does not really focus on the principle of health so much.

So but when Bhakti Vinod Thakur says it’s non literal, what does he mean? He focuses the principle, the principle that we are accountable for our actions. However, in his later books like the Jaiva Dharma, he also talks about hell. So he’s not simply dismissing hell as non literal. I’ll talk about that dimension.

And then lastly, I talk about the difference between hell in the Abrahamic traditions and in the Vedic tradition. Two main differences, that in the Abrahamic tradition, hell is eternal whereas in the Vedic tradition, it is temporary. It is like a it is like a learning place, a tough classroom in the university. And secondly, that hell is there for non believers, anybody who does not believe say for example Jesus is going to go to hell. Whereas in the Vedic tradition, hell is for wrongdoers.

One may not be a devotee of Krishna but still if a person is not harming others, they are not going to go to hell. They may stay in the material existence, they’re not necessarily going to go to hell. So this is not a personal vendetta of God. You didn’t worship me so I’m going to send you to hell. It’s not like that.

So there’s a very significant difference in although the term is same, the conceptions are different. So now I will I’ll talk about three main points. I’ll talk about the concept and then I’ll talk about the principle of consequence and largely I’ll talk about compassion. So now it’s interesting when you use the word concept of hell. Sometimes we may use it in a literal sense and sometimes we may use it in a experiential sense.

Now the word literal itself is a little confusing word. What do we mean by literal? Now, but let me start with first with the experiential. Right in the very next verse in this very chapter, what will Kapila tell his mother? You say, what does he say that?

My dear mother, it is sometimes said that we experience hell or heaven on this planet for hellish planets are sometimes visible on this planet also. So yesterday, I had given the example of how Prabhupada said in concentration camps, people had to eat their own refuse, horrible. So now somebody might draw particular implication from that. So is God like a concentration camp creator? No, that’s not the point of the world.

The point is just as in some places in this world there could be heavenly enjoyment if somebody goes to a five star or seven star Hill Station. So we might say for somebody who maybe has lived in poverty where they don’t even get one proper meal in an entire day, For them, if they go to luxury where there are maybe 50 items for every meal, and they sleep in a comfortable bed and there, so that can seem like heaven to them. So the point Prabhupada was making is not about the cause. The point Prabhupada was making was the varieties of experiences that are present on this planet also, and sometimes we may not see certain experiences within our paradigm or our range of experiences, but that’s like Prabhupada talk about doctor frog, the frog in the well. Just because we have not experienced something does not mean that there’s not it’s not there at all.

So Prabhupada is giving a possibility over there. There’s a difference between explaining possibility and explaining causality. Now why someone goes to hell is a different thing. Possibility means that okay this can happen. So we can say if we have varieties of experiences in the world, so we experience comfortable situations, we experience uncomfortable situations, We experience highly very comfortable situations.

We sometimes we experience unbelievably comfortable situations. So like that, the variety of experiences, this might be the range which we have experienced. But it’s possible that based on what we have experienced, we could say that the reality could be much bigger beyond the range that we have experienced. So that is the point, the possibility is what Prabhupada is emphasizing over here. Now not the causality.

So now when we say possibility of a particular kind of experience being there, in general, in philosophy, there is the standard especially historical investing that is the standard principle called absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Just because we don’t have evidence of something does not mean it is not possible. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. So what Srila Prabhupada is saying is that we have experiences in that direction. And yes, now for most normal people to think of the idea that they would have to eat their own refuse, it’s horrendous, revolting idea, but it has happened in the world, horrible, unfortunate and tragic, horrendous as it is, it has happened.

So Shraddha Prabhupada is expanding the range of our conception of what is possible. Now when we talk about hell, let’s try to understand some key points over here. The hell is now we may have a very simplistic idea that hell is a location. Well, that’s one way of looking at it. It’s actually much more of a condition rather than a location.

It is a location, but it is much more a condition. Just like we may think of the spiritual world, what I’m doing over here now, I’m trying to explain the concept over here. And start by saying, if you use the word non literal, what does non literal mean? Because if you go to if you equate literal with physical and that’s very simplistic, is the soul a literal thing? Yeah, soul is real, it exists, but is the soul physical?

No. It’s not physical. Sometimes we think of going to the spiritual world means, okay, the particular place and we go to that place. Yeah. That’s one way of looking at it.

But say this is America and this is Canada, please forgive my drawing. So this is America and this is Canada. Now now we may think, okay, you said you cross the border and you go from America to Canada. But is it like a spiritual world like that you cross a border and you go there? Now there are illegal immigrants who go from one country to another.

Can you be an illegal immigrant to the spiritual world? Bhakti Siddhanta says Thakur would say that you cannot gate crash into the kingdom of God. So the spiritual world is not just a location, it’s also a condition. One condition of what? It’s a condition of heart, it’s a condition of consciousness and that applies even to the idea of hell.

So hell is not just a physical place, it’s a state of mind, it’s a consciousness. And that’s what the next one is saying, we may experience hellish suffering even in this world also. And one of the things that has happened as modern society has progressed is that things at the physical level have become significantly more comfortable as compared to the past relatively speaking. So physical suffering is something which is quite shocking for us to think about and that’s why the idea of capital punishment is now revolting to most modern or post modern sensibilities. So what has happened is we as a society at the physical level, we have become more and more comfortable.

And say even the prisons in country like America or UK, they are not you go to prisons in India unless we go for prison outreach and the prisons for a person who is from India, some of the prisons in America seem better than many of the homes in India. The idea is that there’s a lot of physical comfort that’s why the idea of physical pain seems very revolting for us. However, pain is not just the physical level, it’s at the mental level also. And this is the paradox in today’s world, many people are increasingly comfortable at the material level, but they are miserable at the material level. As I can say, many people are comfortably miserable.

You know, all mental health problems, there are some people who may end their lives because of physical physical pain or physical discomfort, but most of the people who for example commit suicide is because of mental anguish, a sense of loneliness, abandonment, hopelessness. So now for most of us if we have not been through that much suffering, everybody has known pain, but if we have not been through that much suffering, we might not even be able to think why would anyone want to end their life. But if we go through a situation of terrible pain and then we can identify sometimes the mind might bring up some thought, if a person has certain cultures, certain nature, certain boundaries they won’t do it. But the point is that suffering can be unbearable and there can be unbearable suffering at the physical level and that may be a little unfamiliar to us in today’s world, but there is unbearable suffering at the mental level. I just want to end my life so hell suppose somebody is addict and they’re legally trying to get rid of the addiction but they’re just not able to and they’re feeling the withdrawal pain and it can be like hell for the person over there.

I don’t want to do this but I just can’t live without doing this. So that’s an addict to I wrote a read a book on addictions and addict one said that describe the conditioning, like he says, relationship with the addiction, he says, you treat me badly, I trust you madly. So it’s a very terrible, it’s like a typical definition of abusive relationship. You treat me badly but I trust you madly. Each time somebody indulges they suffer but after that next time the temptation come they just can’t say no.

So that is a hellish condition. So at a mental level, we could say addiction could be an extreme sense of suffering which can seem hellish. So the point of hell is not the specifics of the kind of physical suffering that is being inflicted. The point of hell is that there is a state of suffering. So in scripture, when the language is given, so I’m building on this point of concept only.

See, sometimes the language is descriptive, but quite often, the language is indicative rather than descriptive. Now what is the difference between descriptive and indicative language? Descriptive is what a place is, you describe what it is. Indicative is what it feels like what it feels like. The Garuda Puran is a place where in one of that’s that’s a book where lot of description of hell is given.

The post life journey is described and hell is described. Now you’ll see Nagarapurana is described hell is a place of darkness and hell is also described is said as a place of unbearable fire. Now if if we think of this simply as descriptive language, now fire and darkness don’t coexist, isn’t it? Fire means there is light, so hell is a place of darkness and hell is a place of fire. So now we could go and say we could say no these are two different hells, one is a dark place, the other is a place of fire.

But the Garabhupurana is not literally describing two different hells at many places. So the darkness and fire, they are indicative of what we will experience. So darkness is a place of of loneliness, of abandonment, of feeling completely lost, and fire is a place of agony, it’s a fire of some we can have the fire of guilt, we can have the fire of regret, we can have there is fire, so it indicates different kinds of sufferings. Now if we consider that this is literally a descriptive it’s a literally a description of the conditions, then the question comes up, the Prabhupada is saying over here somebody engage in illicit sexual activity and that’s what the Bhagavatam says. But then we’ll see how are we going to define illicit sexual activity.

Is it a one time indulgence, is it a multiple indulgence, a lifelong indulgence, is it two people coming voluntarily and consenting, is it one person forcing the other person? There’s a whole spectrum and if this was supposed to be a literal description then it wouldn’t be that anybody suppose somebody eats eat months in their life and somebody else doesn’t eat a meal even once in their life which does not have meat. Now can you say both are culpable at the same level? No system of justice would accept that principle. So this is clearly not a literal description of who will suffer how much.

And we see this in Prabhupada’s purport also that if you go back the previous verse, yeah, that Prabhupada is nuance and qualifying certain things. So the Sanskrit is Bhunkte Narova Nariva Mitha Sanghe Nandir Mitha. That this is what the man or the woman will be subjected to if mitha sangen and nirmitha, if they indulge in sexual pleasure, mitha is sexual pleasure nirmitha it is caused by. But Prabhupada is nuancing and he’s saying that those whose lives were built upon indulgence in illicit sexual life. So he’s not just talking about a one time indulgence, the lives are built upon that.

Now that is very different from a one time indulgence. Sometimes somebody may not want to indulge but the temptation may overpower them. Sometimes somebody may indulge but then they may repeatedly but then they may reform afterwards. So this is not so much a quantity another way to understand the difference between this the descriptive and indicative is it’s not so much a quantitative language as a qualitative language that there is consequence for our actions. So when the Bhagavatam describes hell, what is the it’s it’s not describing geography as it much is describing gravity.

Now gravity is not the pull of gravity, but gravity is how grave the situation is, that actions have consequences. So it’s not that when the Bhagavatam describes hell or for that matter it describes any of the places in the cosmos, It’s not like a Google map pin drop. You put the pin and you’ll Google map will take you there. It’s not exactly describing geographical coordinates. It’s describing the principle of gravity.

Gravity is that there are our actions, we are accountable for our actions and therefore, we need to be careful. So the so going back to what Prabhupada said, Prabhupada is not talking about causality over here. He’s talking more about the possibility and the possibility is that even in this world there can be terrible suffering sometimes at the physical level, sometimes at the mental level. And that principle just as in the heavens, there can be pleasure that we can’t imagine. Similarly in health, there can be there can be pains that we may not be able to imagine.

So that the first point of the understanding the concept. Now, let’s talk about compassion. So yesterday I mentioned about how Shluprahipad does not emphasize so much that if somebody engages in it does not emphasize health so much in terms of that being the consequence of wrong actions. Now if you look at the Vedas, there are hundreds of references to hell in Prabhupada’s works. But it’s interesting where does Prabhupada refer to hell?

He’s referring to the conversation between Parikshit Maharaj and Shubhadeva Goswami that follows this description. And Parikshit Maharaj asks how can people be saved from the chilly conditions and that’s the start of the sixth canto and there it is said that you know atonement will not work, it said that ultimately Bhakti will work and then the story of Ajamal is told. And when the story of Ajamal is told, the point is that a devotee when a devotee sees such suffering, such descriptions of suffering, devotees focus is that how can such suffering be prevented for others. The focus is compassion, the focus is not condemnation. It is not to scare people, you’re going to go to hell and scare them into compliance, that is not the point.

A devotee’s mood is always compassion. And this is this compassion is actually Krishna’s mood and this also needs to be a devotee’s mood. Now what do I mean by Krishna’s mood over here? In the Vedic tradition, it’s understood that God is present in our heart and God is present in our heart wherever we go. The verse in the Bhagavad Gita says, so that that on this we are, like, on the vehicle of the body and we wander all over.

So if you seek the Vedic conception of God as Krishna as contrasted with, say, the conception of God in any other tradition, the Abrahamic tradition, So it is not Krishna who sends people to hell. That is not at all the Vedic understanding. It is Krishna, he goes with people to hell. Krishna does not send people to hell, he goes with people to hell when their karma sends them there. People go to hell not because they reject Krishna.

That’s what I’ll send you to hell. No. It is when actually people live in a way that is destructive, in a way that is disruptive and destructive for others, their karma sends them to hell. So now we may say, but karma is also arranged by Krishna only. So it’s Krishna who is sending people to hell.

Well, it’s not that simple because Krishna in the in the Brahmasamita is described, he is the cause of all causes. He is not the cause of all effects. Now again, what do you mean by the difference? Cause of all causes and cause of all effects? Like, say, if you consider rain or clouds, the rain is the cause of all vegetation.

Without this is an example in Vedanta Sutra that without rain, there’ll be no vegetation that’ll grow anywhere, but the rain is not the cause of which vegetation grows where. So the rain is not the cause of, say, a flourishing harvest growing at one place and weed is going somewhere else. That is determined by the kind of seed that are sown over there, kind of care that has been taken over there. So Krishna has created a system of karma, but saying that Krishna sends people to hell is like saying suppose there’s a pilot and the pilot makes a mistake and the plane crashes. And why did the plane crash?

We have to make an investigation to find out what went wrong. If the pilot made a mistake, why did the pilot make a mistake? If the airplane malfunctioned, why did the airplane malfunction? Now some people some person with a half big knowledge of physics comes and says you people, why are you wasting some so much time in making a committee and doing some investigation? I already know what caused the plane crash.

Really? Tell us, do you have some secret intelligence information? What caused the plane crash? He says, No, it’s simple. The plane crashed because of gravity.

Now did the plane crash because of gravity? Well, yes and no. Without gravity, the plane would not crash. But we cannot hold gravity responsible when the plane crashes because the planes are designed to fly in spite of gravity and if a plane crashes and the question is not gravity caused it, why did that mechanism malfunction And that malfunctioning of the mechanism is what is responsible. Was it the aircraft manufacturer’s mistake?

Was it those who are supposed to do a pre flight check, they didn’t check properly? Was it a pilot’s mistake? So we cannot blame gravity for that. That’s why it is not Krishna who is sending people to hell. Krishna has created a mechanism but Krishna does not force anyone to make any choice.

The Bhagavad Gita in four thirteen and fourteen says Tasye kartaram apimam vidya a kartaram avayam. Tasye kartaram apimam Krishna says in four thirteen in the Bhagavad Gita that I am the maker of the whole system but it is not that I place different people at different places in the system, that is by their choices. So Krishna’s compassion is that even if our actions send us to hell, Krishna is there with us in hell. Krishna is the Paramatma never abandons us, and Krishna is always eager for us to be elevated. So Krishna’s love is the biggest reality in the world.

And for us, as we grow spiritually, what happens is this, if if you forget everything else from this talk, you can just remember this one thing. Now for us, initially, the world is very big and God, Krishna, is very small. When I was introduced to Bhakti, I started talking about it with my friends and colleagues and relatives. One of my uncles he told me, yeah, I have a very good relationship with God. He said, really?

I said, what what is it? Just mutual non interference. He said, he’s happy there, I’m happy here. So some people feel that God is completely relevant. Now when we think God is irrelevant, then what happens?

The world is very big for us and the world’s ups and downs also become very big for us. So the world’s ups and downs, they come they impact us a lot on mental level. But as we grow spiritually, the world becomes small and Krishna becomes big for us. So for a devotee, the physical suffering, it’s real but Krishna’s love is a bigger reality. So when Parikshit Maharaj saw that the snake was going to come and bite him and kill him, he knew the snake is going to come, but he also knew that it is actually Krishna’s arrangement.

So for us, what happens is if you the spiritual growth means we see physical reality, we don’t deny okay, it stopped. Okay. It’s interesting. Not seeing anything here. Okay.

So if we say that there is physical reality and there is spiritual reality, the physical reality is important, but for a devotee, the spiritual reality is much more important. And yes, hell may have terrible kind of suffering, it could be at a physical level, it could be in this world, it could be next world, it could be, at a jog at a geographical, the psychological level or at a physical level, but whatever be the suffering, Krishna’s love is a bigger reality. And that will bring me the last point. I think that it’s saying no displays are visible. Okay.

That’s definitely not distracting. Anyway, I’ll I’ll continue without this. Let’s see. And that brings us to the last point that is correction. So if there’s compassion then our focus, compassion is not just emotion, we need to after that do something tangible.

And what is the Bhagavatam’s mood? It’s a mood of correction. So the whole story of the Bhagavatam is told so that people can actually turn toward Krishna and they can they scum? Okay. Good.

So spiritual growth means the physical reality is not as important as the reality of Krishna’s love. So that brings us compassion is yes, a person may suffer in hellish conditions also, but Krishna’s love is the bigger reality and that correction means that we focus not so much on the reality and the gravity of hell. We talk about it but none of our Acharya’s has written a commentary on the fifth canto of the Srimad Bhagavadam specifically. Many of the Acharya has written commentaries on the tenth canto of Shmita Bhagavadam. Now Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu would love to hear the pastimes of Prahlad Maharaj and Dhruva Maharaj, that it does not describe that he love to hear the description of hellish planets.

No. So our focus is on how to help people experience Krishna’s love, how to invite them into that world of Krishna’s love and once they experience that, that is what will protect them from hell. And so ultimately Prabhupada started the International Society for Krishna Consciousness. It is not the International Society for Hell Consciousness that that there is hell and you’ll go to hell if you don’t do this, this, this. No.

That’s not the point. So what our Acharya emphasized that is what we need to emphasize and this correction happens by inspiring others to also develop love for Krishna. So broadly, you know, that the principle is you know. Means somehow or the other fix the mind on Krishna. So each one of us based on our particular background and the kind of background that our audience comes through.

So for some people, hell as a literal description, That can create fear and that fear can inspire people towards correction, towards correction through connection with Krishna and that’s perfectly fine. Now I was in India, there’s a temple in a small in a small village. We have one of our spiritual leaders in India who was born in that village. And in that village, when they build a temple, they’ve actually depicted the depicted the suffering in hell for the four regrettable principles. They made dioramas of how a person who eats meat will have to suffer in this way, how a person who doesn’t eat meat will have to suffer in that way.

Now, when I talk with the devotees who are making the Vedic planetarium, they have decided the Vedic planetarium in in Mayapur to not depict the Hellish planets. So now what is the point over here is, yes, people who may live in villages, they are still in a little bit of pre modern times and idea of a hell may may act as a deterrent for them, oh I don’t want to suffer like this. But for some people the idea of hell if it is what kind of God will create something like this? If that’s the idea then we focus on the idea of hell as a condition rather than a location and the focus is on redirection, yes. Now when we are in a state of godlessness, we suffer and therefore we should turn away.

And for many people, life in this world may itself at a psychological level can be like hell. So the point is we don’t get too caught in whether such descriptions are literal in the sense of being physically exactly the same details happening or whether they’re not happening. What will be foster Krishna consciousness That is what is important. So this is this is the level of Krishna consciousness and different people at different places. So some people in today’s modern sensibilities and there are pre modern sensibilities.

For some people considering the hell to be more of a literal description, this is what happens and this is what we will you will be subjected to or we will be subjected to if we do these things. If that’s what or as I say, whatever floats your boat, you accept that. For some people, this kind of descriptions may not be at all fathomable, acceptable, then we could say, as I said, it can be indicative language. The point is not where we start from, the point is that where we take off. So in Krishna consciousness, often there can be an acceptable range of meanings.

Now if somebody goes outside the acceptable range, that means they start saying that no matter what you do, you’re not going to suffer. This is all just meant to scare and there is no suffering because of, unrestricted indulgence. No. The specific of how suffering may come will vary. But if somebody starts saying that there’s going to be no suffering at all, then that would be outside the range of accepted meaning.

So we focus on cultivating Krishna consciousness and that’s how we grow in our lives and we inspire others to grow. So I quickly summarize what I discussed, three main points in talking about the concept of hell. The first about hell and how to understand, first of the concept. In the concept, I talked about how hell can be seen as a location, but it can also be seen as a condition. And condition means that it’s not just a state of play, it’s not just a physical place, it’s also a state of mind.

It’s not describing geography as it’s describing the gravity of the choices and the consequences. The language can be descriptive, but it can also be indicative. So we can understand this. It’s more a description of not so much of quantity as it is of quality. The specifics are not mentioned over here.

So the concept of hell can range from both ways. Then I talk about the principle of compassion that how what Krishna’s mood is Krishna doesn’t send to hell, He goes to hell with us. So he goes to hell not to suffer but to save us from suffering and that is Krishna’s love for us. So Krishna is the cause of all causes, not the cause of all effects. It is not Krishna who sends people to hell, it is karma which sends and Krishna who saves.

And when the correction our purpose should be correction just as Parikshit Maharaj on hearing this is focused on correction. So Srila Prabhupada’s mood was also on correction. So Srila Prabhupada also sensed the kind of audio that people were there today and then lastly we discussed for us our mood should also be how can I connect people with Krishna and thus there can be an acceptable range within which such statements can be seen? So some people, the literal meaning may inspire them to take to Krishna consciousness. And for some people, it may be a less literal meaning.

So rather than mandating necessary this is the only meaning that has to be taken, we understand that ultimately everyone has to go on the journey toward Krishna consciousness. Everybody needs to recognize that actually Krishna’s love is a far bigger reality than this world, whether it be this world’s pleasure or this world’s pain. And whatever way a person can actually be inspired to perceive Krishna’s love as the bigger reality, we encourage them in that way and move help them move towards Krishna. Thank you very much. Yes, miss.

Guru Maharaj, I’m going to the hell right now. Hell, Maharaj, servant’s just behind me. What should I do? What should I think? I’m very scared.

It’s, like, a dark time for me. Please give me advice. What should I do? I, like, had bad life all my life. I did bad things and now I understand that.

Yeah. What should I do? I think the key point is we need to experience Krishna. We experienced the world and experienced how painful the world is, but to see what gives us experience of Krishna. We have tried the experience of this world, tried displeasure, tried the solution, and it’s it’s really not all that great.

It can be terrible. So how do we experience Krishna? We come in the association of devotees, we participate in Kirtan, we chant the holy names. It like tell such a person give Krishna a chance, try Krishna out. Try to try Krishna out means not just chant the Holy Spirit, it’s important, but try to do something which actually gives you the experience of Krishna.

So maybe come and stay in the association, go to a holy place, take up some spiritual practice that the world is going to be there, it’s not that the world is going to fall apart if you turn away from the world for a few days. Try to immerse yourself in Krishna for some time. So give give yourself an opportunity to experience Krishna and once we do that we’ll get some strength and then greater than the world’s power to hurt is Krishna’s power to heal. But we need to give ourselves the opportunity to be healed by Krishna. And then once we are healed, then we can decide whether we want to go back into the same situation and deal with the situation, we just want to walk away from that situation, But give yourself an opportunity to experience Krishna.

That’s the key answer. Okay? Thank you. Yes, Bhupati. Thank you for two wonderful classes.

And if you asked me this morning what did I like about it, I took notes so I’d be able to not look stupid. I actually But the question I wanna ask is this there’s a famous picture, well it’s famous to Proud Pod Disciples, of Proud Pod being handed the fifth canto. And it’s open to the pictures of the hellish planets. And Prabhupada’s got a big smile on his face. You know that picture?

So as soon as possible? You remember that picture? All the Prabhupada disciples would know that picture. I don’t know if it’s still in circulation. How do you understand that?

Because that’s a lot more than non emphasis. I mean, that Yeah. You know, how do we understand that picture? Would anybody give me a good explanation? I also remember that.

I was thinking about it today. See, what happens is that personally, I’m not saying that the understanding that I have or the understanding that I shared is necessarily the conclusive, the definitive understanding. These are difficult subjects and, we all try to understand them according to our capacity and try to share that understanding. What in the Bhagavad Gita As I have, I think with Madurai and Maitreya, I have a conversation they say, as much as I have heard and as much as I have understood. So now considering that particular picture, I’d say two things.

You know, obviously Prabhupa definitely had a big smile. Now was that smile where just the fact of having the Bhagavatam published already or was it specifically because of that picture? That’s very difficult to say. You know, it could be that Prahopa was smiling throughout and maybe that picture was clicked when incidentally Prabhupada was on that that photo was given, Prabhupada was looking at that picture. So whether it is the description of the hellish planets that pleased Prabhupada, I doubt that very much.

So that’s one point. The second point is if we look at Srila Prabhupada’s overall writings. So when I said non emphasis, see, the the nature of the human mind is to go towards extremes. When you say something is important, we make it all important. And something is non important means we make it completely, utterly unimportant only.

It’s not it’s not utterly unimportant but there is a greed of importance. Say for example, now if somebody is in a place where maybe they are in the they are in a very high demanding job, some emergency duty in medicine or something like that, and they have barely the time to chant their rounds or cook food and offer bhoga and take bhoga. Now if they if they say I will cook bhoga, then they won’t have time to chant their rounds. Now what should you do at that time? Now both is important, we don’t want to take outside food, we also want to chant our rounds.

In that particular situation what will be more important is we need to do our chanting and then adjust, maybe we offer some food in the mind whatever. Now is that the standard? No. But there is a degree of importance. There’s a hierarchy of importance.

In Sanskrit this is called as Taratamya. Taratamya is hierarchy. So my concern when I present such sections is that nobody should leave Krishna consciousness because they find such sections difficult to accept. This is not such a non negotiable part of Krishna consciousness. There are there are two ways to present Krishna consciousness, one is it’s like a digital presentation, the other is an analog presentation.

What do I mean by digital? That you have to accept the whole package. This is Krishna consciousness is a package deal, you accept everything or you are out. It’s one or zero. But the analog is, it’s like Krishna consciousness there is a aspirational level.

Aspirational level means, say, we would like to have altar at our home, we would like to offer Bhogan nicely to Krishna, we would like to chant our rounds in the morning and then maybe you would like to go for a job, whatever job, whatever work you do. That’s aspirational level. But then from aspirational, there could be a non negotiable level. If somebody says that, you know, I’ve got such a busy job that the only food that is available for me in the vicinity of my job is meat, so I’ll eat meat. No, that would be something just seriously non negotiable.

So what happens is Krishna consciousness is a spectrum. So my understanding is at least the way way I’ve seen it, this fifth canto should not lead people to give up Krishna bhakti because they feel this is irrational, this is unacceptable. Either the it doesn’t make sense logic is I can’t accept this in light of science or I can’t accept this in the light of a compassion idea of a compassionate or loving God. So that’s my primary concern. Now can there be other concerns?

Of course, there are other concerns. So I would say Srila Prabhupada, from the seven purposes of ISKCON that he gave, from the name of the society that he gave, from what he expected in these ancient vows, Prabhupada didn’t give us like a 10 summary of Krishna consciousness, like some churches have creeds, this is what I believe in. Prabhupada didn’t give us like that. So therefore there’ll be some room for discussion and ambiguity about what is essential to Krishna consciousness and what is not so essential to Krishna consciousness. So some people may say, no, this is you have to accept Bhagavatam literally.

Every single word of the Bhagavatam has to be accepted literally. Otherwise, you don’t have faith in Krishna. Well, yes, that’s one way of looking at it. But then, do we want people just because they find certain sections of the Bhagavatam difficult to accept, do we want them to leave Krishna consciousness? Like yesterday we discussed that conversation, Prabhupada said if was that the only thing you could present to scholars?

So I think we need to be able to have a big umbrella in which a lot of people can take up Krishna bhakti and then each person will commit to Krishna consciousness in a way that works best for them. Everyone has to become serious about the relationship with Krishna. But what does the seriousness about the relationship with Krishna mean? Does it have to mean the exact same thing for every single person? Maybe, maybe not.

For somebody like even in the practical aspect of Krishna consciousness, for somebody, seriousness in Krishna consciousness means that if you do deity worship, if you fast but that may not be the definition of seriousness focused on much of other people. So you know with respect to practice, we often give people somewhat a flexible rope, you can’t chant 16 rounds, chant four rounds, if you can’t do this, you do this. But with respect to philosophy, why can’t we give people a little bit of a breathing room? If you consider there is a karma marga and there is a jnana marga from both people can come to bhakti. So from karma marga when somebody comes that means these are the rituals to be practiced, these are the rules to be followed, we give people leeway in the rules.

So those who are thoughtful, those who are analytical, they come more from the jnana marga. Now for them they will also need some breathing space. Now this is the exact way, there’s a range of what is acceptable. So in general my experience is that people who come from India, most of them come from the karma marga. Karma Marga means these were the rituals, these were the culture that most of them were practicing.

And they just learn more about the philosophy and they become more reinforced in practicing that. But most non Indians, most especially western people who come, they come more from the Gyan Marga. That means they have existential questions, and they find that their particular tradition did not give them answers to those questions, and that’s why they come. And so for many people from an Indian background or from a more ritual background, these specific descriptions of hell may not matter so much. Okay, let’s tell his description, I’ll just chant Hare Krishna and be happy, what’s the big deal?

For some people who have come from the philosophical direction, we know this whole question, how can a loving God do something like this? That’s a very serious question. So we need to give breathing just as we give breathing room, as we give space for people in terms of what they can practice, can we not give people space in terms of how they understand certain things? So Prabhupada in my understanding gave that space, that’s what Prabhupada called as philosophical speculation. So there is one past and I’ll conclude with this that I think, this is described of Maharaj in one of his vast offerings.

So he said the only difference, so two devotees were having some debate, they said the only difference between Radharani and between Krishna and Balaram is in complexion, other they both same. So one group of devotees said yes, that’s right. And then another devotee said, no. But only Krishna is the lord of Radharani, not not Balramji. That’s right.

Now both these devotees, the debate became very heated so they both went to Prabhupada. And now Prabhupada said, only both sides are presented. Only Krishna, the only difference between them is the complexion. Yes. That’s right.

But only Krishna is, only Krishna is the Lord of Radharani. That’s right. But Prabhupada, both of these can’t be right Prabhupada said, that’s right. And then what is the truth? Probably that you decide.

Now the point over here is there are very advanced truths and we don’t have to adjudicate them right now. So I’d say that’s my understanding over here. Let’s not make this a non negotiable aspect of Krishna consciousness which may make people have to decide to make or break their bhakti. Okay. Thank you.

You want to add something? Okay. You must ask questions. Thank you, Pabhuji, for a wonderful class. One thing that I kind of realized in this what your presentation was that realistically in this world, there is no real retribution.

In other words, if you perform that simple activity, you know, it’s it’s like, that’s it. What what what retribution is there? If you if you don’t really, become Krishna conscious in our particular philosophy, then you’re a lost soul, Literally. I mean, right? Because we’re saying we’re talking about simple activity.

You know, how if you commit this simple activity, what you know, even in the material world, if if you murder somebody, you know, you think you’re getting away with it. But really, if you you you you’re not. You you killed someone, and that’s simple. And that’s even against the law. So even in this country, you can kill somebody if they catch you fifty years later to still put you in jail.

So here we are in a material world and we’re committing so many simple activities knowingly and unknowingly. You know, what’s the repute you know, what what can they do in terms of they’ll be constantly in this cycle of birth and death? Yeah. And that’s exactly the it’s a nice way of articulating this point I’m making, you know. In our tradition, the specifics of how somebody is suffering is not as important as the principle that there is suffering in the material world.

So as long as somebody is in the material world, they will be suffering. And the key point is get out of this material world of suffering. So rather than getting so caught in, you know, this is hell and this is a place of severe suffering, no, the whole world is a place of suffering and unless we get out of that what is the point? It’s like Prabhupada would say there are golden shackles and there are iron shackles. It’s it’s still shackles only.

Thank you, Prabhu. So, Prabhu, my question is in regards to the physical location of health or the spiritual world and the importance. In the other side, we also have the conditional conditioning of the living entity. And that brought me to, some memories about I was reading a book where in the early days, one devotee was, complaining or having a difficult time to understand the the situation of Brindavan and, you know, finding all the different discrepancies. So proper answer is actually, Vrindavan is a state of consciousness.

You can create Vrindavan anywhere you are. So my question would be, it doesn’t necessarily diminish the position of the sacredness of the place. On the other side, my question will be also, is it sometimes more important the condition that you the kind of mentality that you have? Because if I bring it to another like another question, you can be in the presence of the Paramahansa, a great master, but you condition it or you’re you’re not able to, how do you say, take advantage of it? Can you speak?

Good point. See, that’s what I was trying to draw over here. See, if you consider Vrindavan as a place, now it’s is it important to go to Vrindavan and pilgrimage? That’s considered one of the key limbs of Bhakti. So the location is important.

But then our tradition it is also said that what is the use of going to a holy place if you don’t associate with holy people over there. It is like even bathing in a river, it’s like a like a cow or a a donkey. So there’s location without condition. Now this is undesirable or at least not the not the best you can put it that if we are just in the location but not in the condition, in the condition of state, condition of mind, now can there be condition without location? It is said yes that wherever Krishna is glorified that is Vrindavan.

So if a devotee is going on a morning walk with, with Srila Prabhupada, they might be going through some ghettos that will be like the spiritual world. So this is also glorious but the problem is that this may not be what we can experience all the time. So we can be in the condition say we could say that a devotee goes out into the world to distribute books, if they’re fixed in serving Krishna, wherever they’re going that’s a spiritual world only because they are glorifying Krishna, they’re sharing the glories of Krishna. But still can that devotee stay in that location twenty four hours a day and not be affected? No it’s not.

So you know ideal is by the location and the condition both are there. So the physical location matters, but it is not the physical location alone that matters and the state of consciousness also matters. So Vrindavan is a state of consciousness, Vrindavan also place. Ideally, by going to the place we can develop the state of consciousness more easily and we can carry the state of consciousness outside that place also. So what applies to Vrindavan also applies to the spiritual world, so the hellish mentality like a pure devotee may go to hell but a pure devotee may not be suffering in hell rather the pure devotee go there to save people from suffering.

Can be in that condition, can be in the location and not be in that condition. And somebody can be in this world and they can be in a hellish condition. Even if this world is spiritual world itself we have that conception. There is Jeevan Mukti and there is what is called as Atyantika Mukti or final Mukti. Jeevan Mukti is somebody is in this world, in this body, but they are they have no desire to enjoy this world.

So they are as if free from the body. And there is the ultimate liberationist and they give up the body and they go to the spiritual world. So spiritual world is the location as well as the condition. Okay? Thank you.

Thank you so much.

The post Brutal hell & loving God How can both go together part 2 Chaitanya Charan Prabhu SB 3 30 26 5 appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

So since I got this verse, I was told this three, four days ago, I’ve not been able to sleep very peacefully. These are these are in many ways a very difficult section of the Bhagavatam to explain, first of all, to understand and to explain. So today and tomorrow, I’ll be discussing this theme of how the such a brutal hell or a brutal description of hell, how can it be reconciled with the idea of a loving God? That what is described over here, sometimes if we don’t know the language, then sometimes if we don’t know the language when what two people are speaking, we can only make it out, we can only guess it, infer it And India itself is a very multilingual country. So sometimes when somebody is angry, you can make out even if you don’t understand the language by their gestures, by their expressions, by the volume, you can make out they’re angry.

But among the various Indian languages, Bengali is a very sweet language. And I was once in Mayapur and two devotees talking and the whole language sounded very sweet But then after that, the devotee who whom I was talking who was talking to some other Bengali the other day, he after he finished the talk, he was very disturbed. I said, What happened? He said that this devotee, he just spoke so this other person was not a devotee like a person who’s coming to the temple, they’re working some contract on land with him, it’s favorable like this. He spoke such harsh language and such foul words, very shaken.

So I he was speaking in a very plain tone and Bengali is a little sweet language. So sometimes the language might be very sweet but the words might be horrible within it. So like that, you know, if we just come and recite the verses and we don’t know the Sanskrit, this verse can seem like any other verse. Sanskrit is is is a exalted language and if you know how to recite, it can be very sweet to recite also. But what is being talked about over here is is the punishments that are described in hell for those people who have indulge unrestrictedly in sensual pleasures.

So how do we understand this? So today and tomorrow, I’ll talk about this and I’ll broadly use the same approach, use three points, you know, the approach that we take, the context in which this is spoken and T will we’ll talk about transcendence, what the essence of the Bhagavatam is. This is the acronym I’ll use. Now because this is I’m giving class tomorrow also, I’ll have a little time, so I’ll go backwards and rather than focusing on this particular verse itself, we’ll look back at our tradition. And Bhaktivino Thakur was the first person in our tradition who had to encounter modern sensibilities.

If you consider the tradition, the tradition has been going on for a long time if you consider you know, and if you consider tradition to be like lineage, spiritual lineage, then every Acharya does outreach to their particular audience. So for example, Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu did outreach to the people at his times, then the six Goswamis, they were in Vrindavan and they did outreach to their particular audience. Now it’s interesting, the Goswamis hardly wrote any books about Lord Chaitanya because they were based in Vrindavan. In Vrindavan, Mahaprabhu had come and Mahaprabhu had created a sensation. But like any other visiting guest, when the visiting guest come, they say, Oh, huge, I’m Philip, but after the visiting guest goes back, things literally go back to normal.

So Vrindavan was a land of Krishna not of Lord Chaitanya. So they wrote books about Krishna, Krishna Leela, Krishna Attua and they wrote mostly Sanskrit because Vrindavan nobody knew Bengali. So every Acharya speaks to their audiences. So then after that we have Vishnu Acharya who is also in Vrindavan, but he was restoring Vrindavan after it was devastated by the intolerant Islamic ruler Aurangzeb. And then after that we have Baldevidya Bhushan.

Now Baldevidya Bhushan was speaking to a broader audience of the Vedic scholars because what happened was during Aurangzeb’s time, there are many of the deity like Radha Govind deity in order to be protected had to be taken to Jaipur. And in Jaipur there is already an existing religious group, the Ramanandis. And when Radha Govind came he stole the heart of the king over there. And actually the king started giving more patronage to Radha Govind and his worshipers and the previous group that was there, they started becoming very upset. And in order to try to gain back the patronage, they started to challenge the very validity of our tradition itself, the very validity of the worship of the way we are doing it.

So Bal Devidya Bhushan had to respond to that and that’s why although Chetan Mahaprabhu had said that the Bhagavatam is a natural commentary on the Vedanta Sutra, Baldevidya Bhushan had to write a commentary. So it is almost as if Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu said that there is no need for Vedanta Sutra commentary. Vedanta Sutra because he said the same author who wrote the Vedanta Sutra also wrote in his full maturity the Bhagavatam and therefore the Bhagavatam is a natural commentary. But during Bhakti Nota, during Maldive Devotion’s time, this same statement was seen simply as an excuse for not having a commentary because whenever we are discussing or debating with someone, we have to have a common basis of authority. If they don’t accept the basis of that that common basis, so if we are going to debate with somebody who is scientific and we quote the Bhagavita and say the Bhagavita says that we are not physical we are not physical beings, we are souls.

I don’t care what Bhagavita says, we may have to use some scientific evidence, something which they will accept. So the point is that had to write. He felt a strong need for a Vedanta Sutra commentary and nobody considers him in the tradition a deviant for writing such a commentary. Why? Because it was the need otherwise our Samprada itself would have lost its credentials.

So people who did not accept Lord Chaitanya Mahap’s authority, who were challenge challenging him and his tradition, we cannot argue with them by quoting from him. So therefore he had to write a commentary. So why am I giving this background? It’s like in the tradition each Acharya has to fight the battles of that generation and the battles of that generation may be very different from the battles of the previous generation. So if you consider the First World War and the Second World War, in the or we consider Second World War and the and the Cold War, in the Second World War we have Russia and America fought together against Germany.

But as soon as the war got over or even before the war was over when it was clear they were going to win, then there’s a competition between Russia and America who would have more power. So people who were ally allies can become enemies. Similarly, not everybody who were on the one side in the first world war were on the same side in second world war. So basically the battle lines change. In the material world, avidya ignorance always has to be fought.

But just as Krishna takes many Avatars, similarly Avidya also takes many Avatars. Avidya, ignorance also comes in different ways. And the principle in the tradition is that the current avatar, the current incarnation of avidya, of ignorance has to be fought. So each Acharya has to do that. The current avatar of Avidya has to be fought.

And the Baldevidya Bhushan fired the last salvo in the traditional battles. The traditional battles were basically everybody accepted the authority of the Vedas, but they debated fiercely about what was the meaning of the Vedas. The Vedas authority, but what does what the Vedas actually teach, that was the debate. But by the time it was Bhaktivinod Thakur’s time, What happened was the whole battleground had changed because westernization had come to India. And along with the westernization came, it was more of Europeanization if you want to say, you can call it the West or and because of that people were not really so concerned about what is the meaning of the Vedas.

The question was do the Vedas even matter? Do the Vedas even have anything of value? Are the Vedas just old fashioned, outdated, superstitious, irrational, primitive works of works that have no relevance of value today? So, Bhaktiv No Thakur had to fight a different battle and one of the battles that he had to fight was for explaining the Bhagavad. So what is it?

What is this? The, rational presentation of Vedic wisdom and especially of the Bhagavat. Oh, when did it stop? That’s funny. Oh, thank you for informing me.

Okay. Let me see what can I do over here? It got disconnected somehow. Maybe I just have to keep writing, otherwise, it gets disconnected. It’s come.

It’s come. Okay. Of the Bhagavatam. So he was the first person who had to give a rational presentation of the Bhagavatam. And Prabhupada in one of his talks on the while celebrating Bhaktiorn Thakur, his appearance disappearance days, he says, Bhaktiorn Thakur is the founder or the father of the modern day Krishna consciousness movement.

What he meant was that it is Bhaktirath Thakur who set the example in the standard of how to engage with modernity, how to engage with modern modernity and specifically the challenge of modernity was rationality. So modernity came with its own sensibilities and these descriptions of hell in one sense in pre modern times were not that provocative for many reasons. One reason was in the pre modern medieval times in general punishments were quite brutal. We know in France there’s a guillotine where people would just be killed. Even in Chaitanya Mahaprabhu’s time they did this guy the Changa, Changa was like swords are kept upside down, swords kept up and somebody is thrown on top of that and that is what happened in Bengal.

So the medieval and the they were physically quite brutal times and there were ways in which people were punished. So but in the modern time, the sensibilities changed and when the sensibilities changed, there are many questions that came up. So I so at that time, Bhaktivinath Thakur wrote an essay called the Bhagwat. And in that essay, he talks about what are the difficulties in understanding the Bhagwat, and he primarily talks about three difficulties. So in fact, he almost takes an autobiographical role over there.

He says that when I grew up, you know, I had an aversion to the Bhagavatam and he said I felt there’s nothing of value in it. So he’s talking to people of a similar background who have all been educated in the Western, the European way of thinking and he’s empathizing with them. He says that, Yeah, I was also like that. And he says there are three challenges, the first challenge is based on cosmology. So the second challenge is based on morality and the third is based on philosophy.

So he says the cosmology, the time scales, the description of the planets, all this just seems utterly irrational. It just seems what science has revealed is totally different from what the Bhagavatam is telling. Then with respect to morality, he focuses primarily on the morality of the character of Krishna and he says that many people considered at that time, especially Christian missionaries in order to target Hinduism, the religion of that country at that time, targeted on the immorality of the characters. So basically, when when the British infiltrated into India, initially the East India Company which was ruling did not allow missionaries to come in because they said that we are here for business and they saw that Indians are very religious, so let’s not mess with their religion. And they also saw that the last Mughal king was Aurangzeb and the main reason one of the reasons one of the main reasons why he just fell was that he just persecuted Hindus a lot.

And that’s why the Hindu just relentlessly fought against him, so they decided let’s not mess with these people’s religion. So, at that time many of the missionaries, the protestants, the Anglican church mainly, they would stay outside India in Burma and they would come Bangladesh was the border state, they would come in illegally, they were illegal immigrant preachers, they would come in and go back. But then, in Britain also, there were two political parties and they were just like here, one political party goes, another political party comes. A lot of policy changes happened. So there was one political party which was more on the rational side, scientific and scientific progress, the other was on the more religious side.

So in the British elections, when the party that was more on the religious side, the Tory party, they won. They said that that so the the Christians who were supporting them they said that, We’ve got this huge unchurched land, This is our duty to Jesus, we have to church them, we have to civilize them. And then that’s when the missionary work started very heavily. So basically both so the the rationalists, those who wanted scientific progress they criticize Hinduism as irrational and the Christians criticize Hinduism as pagan. So both were criticizing and their criticism was basically they talked about how every deity in the Vedic tradition, Krishna is so immoral.

And at that time the other deity that was very popular in worshiping in Bengal was Kali. So Kali is so brutal. So Kali is brutal and Krishna is immoral and Nabaktino Thakur was us living and teaching and trying to present body of Vaishnavism at a time when this came up. And now what happens is that this to the modern sensibility, the description of hell seems both, It seems brutal and it seems immoral. So this is the cosmology, the morality, and the philosophy.

So the description of hell as it is given in the Bhagavatam. Now the Christians did not critique that much because even in the Biblical tradition there is similar description of hell. The specifics may vary, but there is quite a brutal description of hell. Now when the cosmology is concerned, at that particular time, now also we are facing this challenge when we are building the planetarium, how do we actually explain the fifth canto, how do we depict the fifth canto? So these are challenges, it’s not like a one and done thing.

One Acharya gives an explanation and everybody accepts the explanation. It is an ongoing challenge that we face. So it is to address some of these challenges especially the challenge of cosmology, Bhaktivinath Thakur wrote a book called the Krishna Samhita. Now this is among his more controversial books because in this he took a somewhat of a non literal approach to the Bhagavatam and many traditionalists did not appreciate that approach. And Bhaktivedanta Thakur in his own writings later says he wrote his own autobiography in the form of a long letter to one of his sons Lalita Prasad and there he says many people misunderstood this book.

Nobody understood what I was trying to do with this book. So there we see even nowadays also in our movement there’s a debate between conservatives and liberals and people feel misunderstood, people feel attacked. So Bhaktivirath Thakur himself went through all that. He felt attacked. But anyway, I’ll talk about how he has dealt with this and then we will move forward and we’ll talk about this.

So in one sense Srila Prabhupada is trying to in the purport make this relatable for us. He says that in the holocaust terrible things happened, the concentration camps people were forced to eat their own refuse and so it’s no wonder that in hell something like this happened. But then while Prabhupada is trying to make it, you know, these things happen in this world also, they will happen in hell also. But for some people instead of making it relatable, it makes the whole idea of God unrelatable. That means what happens is that I was just talking with one American devotee, he said that when he read this he says that the thought that came in his mind is that what this purport is saying is that Krishna is like Hitler, that Krishna is a creator of a concentration camp worse than what Hitler created.

So sometimes what happens is intent is one thing but what the intent completely backfires. So how do we explain this? So I’ll talk about a lot of things, but first I’ll go into the approach that Bhakti Vinod Thakur takes. So specifically with respect to the descriptions of hell, Bhaktivinath Thakur seems to take a fairly non literal approach and he says that it is the principle of accountability for our actions that is vital that each one of us for whatever we do we will be held responsible. Beyond that the specifics are not that important.

The specifics are given to create fear so that people will stay moral, that people will do the right thing. Now this is not an unfamiliar approach. Bertrand Russell was a prominent atheist and when he would have discussions of atheism, he would have them in his library and he would lock the doors so that none he would have his intellectual friends come and discuss, but he would not want any of his servants to hear his discussions of atheism. Why? He said he felt that if the servants start believing that there is no God, then they will start stealing my silver and my gold from my house.

So the idea that fear will keep people in line, that is not an uncommon idea. And in many ways every country has this that if there is no fear of the law, then people will just there’ll always be criminal elements and they will just run wild. So Bhakti Rudhakur says such descriptions are given to create fear, not fear in the sense of terror, but fear for the sake of what is called as deterrence. Fear can be I’m sorry. Fear can be either for the purpose of creating terror and keeping a person to live in fear forever or fear can also be for deterrence.

Deterrence is where a person is just like you know India and Pakistan and China, these three countries have had lot of wars before. But now every one of them has has nuclear weapons. And although there are many confrontations there, it has not been outright war because there is deterrence. So this is these are meant to be deterrence, that’s what his mood is. So now Prabhupada did not quote Krishna Samhita much, he mentions this once or twice, he did not quote explicitly from Krishna Samhita so much except for one theme, but he did not reject Krishna Samhita directly.

At the same time, Prabhupada, while he did not directly say that the description in hell of hell are non literal, he certainly did not emphasize them too much. He did not emphasize them too much. If you for example, in the Christian outreach, often they start with if Jesus is the only way, if you don’t surrender to Jesus, you’re going to go to hell and you’re going to go to hell forever. So that God loves you so much that if you don’t love him back, he will send you to hell forever, you know. And unfortunately, this is not a caricature of Christianity.

So Bhakti Vinod Thakur himself talked about four levels at at which people can approach God. There is fear, there is desire, there is duty, and then there is love. So fear and desire is the level of karma kanda mostly. If you don’t do this, you’ll be punished by God. If you do this, you’ll be rewarded by God.

The fear and desire is the level at which most of the world’s religion operates. At the level of duty, it is more of karma yoga, nishkam karma yoga. When one understand that God has already done some so much for me, I have a duty to take care I have to serve him. Now love is the primary level at which we approach God in Bhakti Yoga. So now what Bhakti No Thakur states, I’ll talk about one last point and then we’ll have some questions if there are and we’ll continue tomorrow.

The key difference, the first point in reconciling, the idea of a loving God with the brutal descriptions of hell is that our while the term hell is the same, but the conception in the Vedic tradition is very different from what is there in the Abrahamic tradition. What is the difference? There are two main differences, the first is in the Abrahamic tradition hell is eternal, we go to hell and stay forever. In the Vedic tradition although hell is described it is temporary. It is when Srila Prabhupada was asked, Is hell eternal?

Prabhupada replied that, Nothing except ecstatic loving service to Krishna is eternal. So hell is temporary. So hell is in one sense if you can say in the Vedic tradition the whole universe is like a university. We are all meant to learn lessons, learn ultimately what matters and go towards that. And so within this university, hell is like a tough classroom.

Sometimes some kids are very very unruly, maybe they are sent to something which is a like a very difficult or something like a boot camp, they’re sent over there. So hell is like a tough classroom. So no society can actually flourish, even survive without a certain level of law and order and discipline. And if God does not have that system of disciplining people, then where is the question of justice and without justice where is the question of love? So it is not a condemnation.

So what is the implication of this that it is eternal, it is temporary? The implication is hell is for condemnation that you didn’t love God so you’re going to go to hell. But if hell is temporary, it is not for condemnation, it is for reformation. So it is not that God has permanently condemned us, it is that God wants us back and God wants us to reform. And another critical difference is that in the Abrahamic tradition, hell is for non believers.

If you don’t believe in Jesus, you don’t accept Jesus as your savior, you’re going to go to hell. In the Vedic tradition, hell is not for non believers, it is for wrong doers. It is not that just because you don’t worship Krishna you want to go to hell. Somebody may not be worshiping Krishna and if they are living in Sattva Guna, in the mode of goodness Krishna says, So somebody is charitable, somebody is kind, somebody is polite, and maybe they don’t believe in God, they’re a good person. They won’t they’re not good enough to go back to Godhead, but they’re just being good, But they won’t be sent to hell.

So this is not the personal vendetta of God. You didn’t believe me, so I’ll send you to hell. No, it is not like that. That is this actually when when you say have the implication that hell is for non believers, so these together are one point and this is a second point. When you say hell is for non believers, it is for almost like a vengeful God.

The idea becomes that God is vengeful. But whereas here, it is not a vengeful God, but a lawful God that if you create trouble for others, if you hurt others, if you harm others, then you will be punished. So the conception of God itself is very different and therefore can we reconcile the idea of hell with a loving God? Yes, it is possible because hell is not eternal and God does not send people to hell just because they don’t love him. It is because they are causing harm to others that they go to hell.

So I so I’ll continue this tomorrow and I’ll talk further about what is the specific bhakti wisdom about it. So I talked till now about the broad Vedic challenge and the Vedic wisdom. So I’ll summarize what I discussed today. We’re talking about hell and God’s love, can the two be reconciled. So I talked about how first there is the challenge that is there for the tradition always that always there will be ignorance and every has to face the current incarnation of avidya that is there.

And then within that we talk about how Bhakti Vinod Thakur faced the challenge for the Bhagavatam at three levels. And three levels is that it’s it’s cosmology, it’s morality and it’s philosophy. And within that the approach that he takes for this is to say that this is non literal, that the principle is that hell that we are accountable for our actions. Now Srila Prabhupada does not take that approach but Srila Prabhupada, this is non important in the sense that Prabhupada did not emphasize it. Prabhupada did not start by saying that don’t worship God or you’ll go to hell.

Prabhupada’s approach was much more at higher level. We’ll talk about Prabhupada’s approach tomorrow. And finally, we discussed about the difference in the conception of hell in the Abrahamic traditions versus the Vedic traditions. The Abrahamic traditions, it is eternal and that’s why it makes a serious difference whether it’s temporary, it’s eternal, it’s for condemnation of a reformation and the Abrahamic traditions, it is for non believers. So it’s almost like God is out to take revenge against those who don’t love him.

But in the Vedic tradition, it is for wrongdoers, those who hurt others. So this is what gives the idea of a lawful God. Now after talking about a lawful God, tomorrow I’ll talk about how it can be reconciled with the idea of a loving God also. Thank you very much. Hooray Krishna.

Any comments from? Okay. Okay. Yes, from here. Yeah.

Yeah. So how would you respond to a person who says, well, I like your, conception much better than the Christian conception. But, you know, here in in America and Western countries to have a saying, if you give a fool enough rope, he’ll hang himself. So it seems like Krishna is giving people a lot of rope. Why doesn’t he, you know I mean, the Bhagavad Gita says, why hasn’t he, you know, cut us off at the past, so to speak, before we hang ourselves because you know Well, I would say hell is the way he cuts us off the path.

So it’s like when actions have consequences, that’s what brings us to our senses. So in general, one person can guide another person only in three ways like many times when parents ask how do we guide someone, how do we guide our children, there are broadly three ways. First is conscience, that the conscience is like an innate voice, something just cannot be done. If we grew up seeing our parents never doing something, it’s out of question, no matter however angry you are, you don’t hit anyone. Then we ourselves certainly it’s wrong.

So conscience is like the voice of emotion, but it’s not just emotional, it’s that innate sense this is like an inner compass. Now if the compass is not there then there is intelligence. Intelligence is where we appeal to a person, you tell him if you do this, this is what is going to happen. Intelligence is where you give the person a vision of the consequence that is going to come. And if intelligence doesn’t work, then there is the experience.

Experience of what? Experience of the consequence. So broadly speaking, we cannot do anything, we cannot force anyone to do anything. Consciences, they just immediately feel it’s wrong, so I can’t do it. Intelligence is, okay, I see this is bad, so I’ll not do it.

Like somebody just feels, I don’t I don’t wanna kill animals. I don’t wanna hurt animals. He says, oh, if I eat red meat, I’ll get a heart attack. I don’t want to do that. Somebody gets a heart attack, he says, okay, now no more eat meat, red meat.

So basically, there’s a three way. So in one sense, hell is the way by which God is ensuring that the rope is not too long. So hail hell is where God is giving experience to people so that they can reform. Okay? Thank you.

Thank you. It’s true. Yes. All through. After thank you for a wonderful class.

What what comes to mind when you’re reading things of this this stature is that it it’s so phantasmagoria practically. I mean, it’s like not it’s like a movie or something. How how how do you get the living energy to understand these principles of freedom like Krishna conscious when you have to read these kind of descriptions which how many people would really believe. In other words, if you’re out there, you’re talking to a normal person and you know, he’s eating a hamburger and you said, well, if you continue eating that, you’re gonna have to take a you know, somebody’s gonna eat you or you’re gonna have to eat something else. So how how do you how do you take that particular idealism and and give it to someone to make them sincere or, help them understand these these principles from the Bhagavatam?

It’s tough. That’s why the principle which I find is best is choose our battles. There’s a very almost humorous conversation when Prabhupada was in Hawaii, some devotees came and told him that Prabhupada, when we try to talk with the scholars and we tell the scholars that that in Dwarka the king Ugarasen had some astronomical number of bodyguards. It’s quite a phenomenal number. So they started laughing at us.

They said where were their toilets, where are their homes, how could they live in Dwarka? Now Prabhupad could have Dwarka, so does he hear really? Or maybe it is two different places also, maybe there’s So anyway Prabhupad took different approach at different time. Prabhupad here, he said that in this conversation, among all the sections of the Bhagavatam, was it the only thing you found to speak to the scholars? So it is what is one of the one of the choosha battles means what?

Krishna’s Prabhupada himself says intelligence means to see things in their proper perspective. That’s what he said in the tenth chapter of the Bhagavata Purport, Buddha, Gyanama Sam, Mohan at ten point three four five. So that means we ourselves need to know what are the big things in our philosophy and what are the not so big things. So from Srila Prabhupada’s example itself we know how often did Prabhupada talk about hell. Generally when he talked about giving up sense gratification, it is not that you’ll go to hell if you do sense gratification, that is the general Christian version of they use the word adultery, adultery or fornication, you’ll go to hell and you’ll suffer in hell.

Prabhupada’s approach was this pleasure is so insignificant, you are meant for far greater pleasure. So Prabhupada took a particular approach. So my understanding is first is we don’t talk about it ourselves and we don’t this could work as a deterrent at a particular time. Now it doesn’t work as a deterrent and that’s why we are having this discussion about how to explain it. So to some extent it is possible although there is so much propaganda about sense gratification in the world today, many people soon realize that there’s nothing so great about it.

It’s just that because they don’t know any alternative they keep trying it and they keep trying it in new ways sort of hope that they’ll get some pleasure. But for many people if they they can be presented Krishna consciousness in an attractive way and they experience the happiness of Krishna consciousness then okay you know this you know there is better way to live and that’s how they give up sense gratification. So I think that’s the much more healthier approach rather than so I think this is the approach of intelligence rather than experience. You know, there is a better way to live, there is a better way to enjoy life and so we nowadays so there is enough arguments like we can make health arguments for giving up meat, we can make arguments based on environment which is a big concern for people. There’s also an argument based on I I talk about meat eating and talk about help the world with your food.

Well, I had all four things. One is at a health level it is beneficial, at the environmental level it’s beneficial, at the level of livestock, you know, so many people are killed just for your food. And then at the level of poverty itself, global poverty, That is if the amount of land that is used to make meat is used to raise grains for human beings, then far more people can be fed. So poverty itself then, that is not just us, UNESCO has said that. So this is basically there are different ways that’s why I said I give the example of what Chetanya Mahaprabhu said there is no need for this and Balibayash said we have to do this, we have to write a comment to the Midland Sutra.

So I think the same purpose but different approaches to that purpose. I personally wouldn’t use hell at all to talk about it to people. Okay. Thank you. Should we yeah.

There is one statement that says that whatever is written in the verus has to be taken as true. Either you like it or you don’t like it. So I try to understand in the Srila Bhakti Vinodakur statement and Srila Prabhupada in which take it literally and the other one is not that important. See, actually whatever is written has to be taken as truth that is that is there is a statement like that. At the same time there is a clear understanding of context.

So for example, in the Bhagavad Gita itself in 2.17 Krishna says Avinashita tadviddhi, that the soul cannot be destroyed, the soul is indestructible. And yet in the same Bhagavad Gita in the sixteenth chapter ninth verse, sixteenth chapter 20 verse, Krishna says that these things will destroy your soul this will destroy your soul So these will these are soul destroyers. So now there’s just no way both of these statements can be taken literally and they will be true. So then we have to look at the bigger picture. So So what is Krishna saying that here it’s non literal that Krishna is saying the souls spiritual tendency, the souls spiritual awareness that will be destroyed.

So we have to look at the context and that’s why while Shabda is the highest but pratyaksa and Anuman are also required. Yuga Swami used the example of Sandarbas that if somebody says that he lives that his house is on the Ganga. Nobody can house a house on the Ganga unless we are going to make a whole stretch of imagination and say this person is a mystic yogi who has built a house which floats on on there. Okay. This is the way to tell me to finish the class now.

Okay. So the thing is that we have to use our intelligence. So pratyaksha and Anuman, so by pratyaksha we know that there cannot be any house on the Ganga then it means it’s on the banks of the Ganga. So we have to propach and we have to make do we don’t want to do mental speculation but philosophical speculation is required. So there are clearly sections in the Bhagavatam which are in the scriptures which just cannot be taken literally.

So I would say it is that’s why studying scripture requires faith but also requires intelligence. And if it were only based on faith just take it literally true everything as it is then why do we even need commentators. I just this is it that’s all there is in fact that is one of the big split between the Catholics and the Protestants Some at least some of the Protestants say that the scripture is self evident, we don’t need any commentary. But then when it’s self evident which part is are you going to accept? Because in the Bible also there are contradictory strict ways.

So we need an approach that’s why when we would say whatever is said in scripture is true, that is true. But there are two ways to approach, one is with faith and the other is with intelligence and both are important. It is not only faith, if you have only faith we can become fanatical, if we have only intelligence we’ll become skeptical or even cynical. So we don’t want to go in either directions. We want to have a balance of faith and intelligence.

Okay. Thank you. So I think, should we continue tomorrow with any other questions or? There’s more question. Okay.

Do you have a question? Please take yours. I’ve been trying to find, because sometimes when speakers speak about this subject matter in class, they say that the soul the subtle body in the hellish planets when he’s being punished, he experiences it as being a long, long period of time. But we know it’s not eternal. But we also hear speakers say that, it’s actually just a flash of time, but his experience of it is very a long time.

So I haven’t been able to find that anywhere in the fifth kendo or the, third kendo. Do you do you know where that’s? Yeah. I mean, I also not heard about it. Is it?

Yeah. But they just talked about the traveling, it didn’t talk about the punish Okay. So what she is saying is suffering in hell. I’m talking about the suffering, not the traveling. So I think two things over here that, like, it is said in the in the that he has to pass 900,002 and then he’s at once engaged in tortures of his village.

Then he’s at once engaged in the torturous punishment which is just trying to go to hell. So so what does say that? Within a few moments, so it doesn’t does it say over here that it feels like a long time? It doesn’t exactly say that. But my point is that, you know, I, this notion that suffering that that the relativity of time, that something can be very short time but can feel very long, No, that that is not something which is completely outside our domain of experience.

Even Einstein talked about relativity of time, that’s how he explained that. Now if you’re sitting on a hot if you’re sitting on a hot, hot pan somehow, then in a few moments will feel like hours. And if you’re talking with somebody attractive whom you love, even several hours will feel like minutes. So it’s like sometimes we have a nightmare and it may just be for a few minutes, but when every nightmare we feel it’s very long. So the experiential level, pain doesn’t seem to be short, pain does seem to go on for a very long time.

So I think even if there’s no explicit scripture for that, it’s it’s something which is a reasonable inference from our own experience that what could be a short period could also seem very long, okay. So thank you very much.

The post Brutal hell & loving God How can both go together part 1 Chaitanya Charan Prabhu SB 3 30 25 4 appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

Hare Krishna. I’m grateful to be here with all of you today. And today, I’ll speak on this verse from the Bhagavad Gita. This is 2.14. So am I audible clearly?

Oh, okay. It’s gone. It had connected just now. Okay. Thank you.

This one? Okay. Thank you. So the topic I’ll speak on today is tolerance. Now what does tolerance mean and how to tolerate?

Recently I have been in a tour of America for about one and a half one and a half months now, the part of a three month tour and I was asked this question that this idea that Krishna tells in the Bhagavad Gita tolerate and this won’t that lead to some people doing abuses and we thinking that oh I’m just meant to tolerate and we continue tolerating. So what does tolerance mean and how tolerance is actually a great power provided it is understood properly. That’s the theme I’ll discuss. So when something bad is happening to us, when do we tolerate it and when do we decide not to tolerate it. That’s the broad topic I’ll discuss.

So this is extra from my latest book, this is for prayers inspired by the Bhagavad Gita. So in this I have taken each key verse of the Gita and there is a small poetic rendition of the Gita’s verse and then there is a prayer inspired by that verse. So let’s recite the words. So the theme I am talking about is that what you talk let tolerance increase my intelligence, oh lord, not my importance. Tolerance is not meant to make us powerless.

So let us look at these words, Those of you who are familiar with the font can recite after me. So once more we’ll recite. One last time now. This time we decided together all of us, not responsibly but together. Together.

So I tried to do a poetic translation of the verses over here. From the contact of senses with their objects comes joy and pain. These are time bound like winter’s cold and summer’s rain. They come and go forever, they never stay. Tolerate them all, march firm on your way.

So they never stay, march firm on your way. So this is the key over here that Krishna is telling us to march ahead. We’ll read one or two sentences from here. So when we are going through life, how do we decide which battles to fight? We’re all fighting some battle or the other.

So right now, you’re sitting here. Maybe there’s a battle in your mind. You know, you have got so many things to do at home. You hope this class won’t go too long. Maybe you’re hungry and there’s a battle.

Maybe if I go right now, can I get food in advance? Or maybe you want to focus on this class, but sitting on the floor is not so comfortable. So constantly, there are many things going on in our head and like that many things are going on in our world. And we cannot fight all the battles that are happening in the world. So in one sense when Krishna talks about tolerance, the key to tolerance is choosing our battles.

That means we decide which battles I’m going to fight and which battles I’m not going to fight. So I was in Australia and I gave a class over there one sitting in a temple. And there’s one young man who comes for my classes there regularly every year when I go, and he gives after my class, we have an intelligent discussions with him. He gives some thoughtful points how he appreciated. So my class topic was tolerance.

And so after the he he came a little late, so he’s sitting behind it. After the class, I asked him, so what do you like about the class? So he said, see, normally your classes are very intellectually stimulating. He says, but in today’s class, I got to practice what you taught. You know, my class was on tolerance.

So I was thinking you had to tolerate my class? So there’s a Jewish saying, have your ears heard what your mouth has said? So that he saw my expression. Yeah. And he said, no, no.

Actually, I was sitting behind. And when I was sitting behind, the person next to me was constantly talking on phone. His phone was not silent, phone was beeping, and he’s also talking quite loudly on the phone. I was annoyed with that person. But then I thought the class was on tolerance, so I tolerated.

But then because I was tolerating, I couldn’t hear any of the class. So I told him with all due respect, whenever somebody uses the phrase with all due respect, what is going to come after that is not going to be very respectful. So I told him, with all due respect, that is not tolerance, that is importance. So now, what does it mean that it’s not tolerance but importance? You see in this particular verse, which we are discussing right now, this is two fourteen in the Bhagavad Gita, This is well known as Tam Sitiksha Sabharata.

Here Krishna is talking about tolerance. And so I’ll be talking about tolerance in three broad perspectives and using the word acronym called WIT, w I t. The three aspects of tolerance. Now before Krishna cues a call for tolerance, there is the words So before that Krishna is giving intelligence. So we need to have intelligence, a synonym for intelligence is wisdom.

So that’s the first w, but first we need to have wisdom or intelligence. And what is wisdom about? Wisdom means to know which are the big things in our life and which are the small things in our life. So when there’s a lack of wisdom, what happens is we need to make small things very big. If somebody has to go somewhere urgently and they drive, although they they are driving a car, although they know there are no brakes in the car.

I want to get there very fast. Will you get there somewhere else very fast? Isn’t it? So what is the big thing? Okay.

Going to a particular place is important, but surviving is much more important. So which thing is more important and which thing is less important? Which is a big thing, which is a small thing? Understanding that is wisdom. And without wisdom, tolerance has no meaning.

Now if you go forward, this is going to be the key of our talk, but what is tolerance? Tolerance is basically that we are able to keep small things small. Tolerance is where we keep small things small and we keep thereby big things big. We keep small things small and we keep big things big. What does this mean?

That in this case of this young man I was telling him, say, if you come for a talk, the big thing is to hear the talk. Now while getting the talk, we may want to sit on a chair, but sometimes all the chairs are occupied, so to sit on the floor. That may be a little inconvenient. But, okay, the talk is going to go for me forty five minutes, one hour. I can tolerate that discomfort of sitting on the floor.

So relatively speaking that’s a small thing so that I can do the big thing of hearing the class. But if I’m coming for the class and I can’t hear the class only and that interference, that distraction, that noisiness if I tolerate that, then what is happening is I’m not able to do the big thing. So tolerance is actually about keeping small things small, when you keep small things small, you can actually keep big things big. And conversely, when you keep big things big, you can also keep small things small. So but tolerance cannot be exhibited unless we have the wisdom of the intelligence to know what is a small thing and what is a big thing.

So here itself in the Gita Krishna is calling Arjuna to tolerate. Now does the tolerance mean that oh the Kauravas the opposite side in the army has done horrible atrocities. They tried to kill his brother, they tried to assassinate him, burn him and his entire family alive, they tried to disrobe his wife, they cheated and defrauded them of all the property and on top of that they had no remorse, no repentance. The way they try to humiliate Draupadi eventually in the same place in a similar way they try to dishonor Krishna. That’s when the Pandava decided enough is enough.

So when Krishna is telling tolerate is he telling okay you know just accept all the atrocities that the Kauravas have committed, just tolerate it and live with the injustice. Is that what Krishna is implying? Actually Krishna is calling upon Arjuna to fight. So what to tolerate is important to understand. When Krishna is telling Arjuna to tolerate it is not tolerate the Kauravas atrocities.

The Kauravas have committed many atrocities and they are not to be tolerated. Now what is it that Krishna is telling Arjuna to tolerate? Here it is, the pain of fighting against his elders. He has to fight against Bhishma, he has to fight against Drona. These are the people from whom he learned archery, these are the people for whose pleasure he learned archery.

But unfortunately, now duty is calling him to fight against them. It’s very difficult but Krishna is telling him, yes it’s difficult but you need to do it because this is the way you’ll be able to do your duty, you’ll be able to establish Dharma. So the bigger cause of establishing a virtuous order in society is important and therefore tolerate the pain of fighting against Vishnu Mindrula. So before we can actually tolerate we need to have the wisdom to know what is a big thing in our life and what is a small thing And then we can keep the small thing small and then we move toward the big thing, we can focus on the big thing. When Srila Prabhupada was in India, not many people were coming for the outreach that he was doing from 1920 to when he met his spiritual master.

From that time he was trying in various ways to reach out to people and especially after 1940 he started focusing more and more on outreach and till 1965 he was trying many things and somehow there was not much success. Various reasons Prabhupada was primarily preaching in English. Most people even those times did not really were not really comfortable with English. Prabhupada was giving a more philosophical spirituality. Indians at that time were more interested in Katha centered, story centered spirituality.

And India was very much infatuated by the West. So now Prabhupada could have said, okay, you know, maybe people are not coming, what can I do? Maybe this is Krishna’s plan for me, let me accept it. Nobody is coming, nobody is interested, what can I do? I’ll accept it.

No. Prabhupada didn’t accept. Prabhupada tried to change things. The change he did was he came all the way from India to America. Now why he came?

We’ll talk about that as a part of later strategy. But the point is when something bad is happening, something unwanted is happening, it is not an automatic virtue to simply tolerate it. First we have to see what is the big thing in our life and what is the small thing in our life. So now after we have decided this, then the next point that comes up is does anyone remember the acronym? WIT, yes.

WIT. So W is wisdom. We need to know what is the big thing. So the whole point of tolerance is that keep small things small so that you can keep big things big. Otherwise, what happens is if we lack tolerance, sometimes we may life is always filled with ups and downs.

So there’ll be good times and there are bad times. In any relationship, there can be good times, there can be bad times. You know, any job we are having, sometimes the boss may just ease us, sometimes somebody may be rude to us, sometimes it may be very pleasant, we may get a lot of success. Now, often what happens to us if we do not have the capacity to tolerate, then when we go through ups and downs, our mind goes way up and way down. So this is what makes people very unstable.

So nowadays this is becoming more and more. Sometimes when something good happens, you know, two people meet each other and they have some pleasant interactions. One person says, I love you. I can’t live without you. And a couple of days later, we had one unpleasant interaction, I hate you, I can’t live with you.

So it is just we become very very unstable and what happens is these phases will come and go. So if we lack tolerance then we all have emotions that are often reversible, we often have emotions that are reversible. But if we don’t have tolerance, now tolerance means what? Yeah, this is the bad phase we are going through and this phase will go. I’m feeling terrible right now, this phase will also go.

But if there is no tolerance, then due to reversible emotions, we end up making decisions that are irreversible. So this is a great danger. If we lack tolerance, see when we are going through a bad phase, we’ll feel terrible. And in that terrible phase, what is the point of all this? Oh, when people when the people in the relationship they say it’s a break up.

When there is no up actually, it’s a break down most of the time unfortunately. The thing is that we don’t want reversible emotions to lead to irreversible decisions. So for example, there are some people who are very emotionally unstable. So when something good happens to them, they go way up and they think, now I can I have so much energy, I can shake the whole world? So it’s like this is a manic they have a manic level of energy.

And then something bad happens and they go so down that they go into complete depression. Psychology calls this the manic depressive personality. So one day they seem to have so much energy they can shake the whole world. Next day, when something goes wrong, it seems the whole world can’t shake them out of their bed. They just want to pull a blanket over their face and stay there.

So now this is if okay these faces will come they will go, don’t take them so seriously. Sometimes when something goes wrong in the people’s lives, this is terrible, I’ve lost everything, not everything. But, starting I’ve lost it, this has gone wrong, that has gone wrong, that has gone wrong. Our mind starts replaying everything that has gone wrong in our life, starting if my life itself is wrong. And that’s how sometimes people may try to end their life itself and that’s totally irreversible decision which arises from a reversible situation.

So what happens is that if we don’t have tolerance then we make a small thing very big. Yeah, it was a loss but it’s not the end of the world. So when there is no tolerance, what happens that we all will experience loss in our life, but we all will process loss differently. The loss could be loss of a job, loss could be loss of our savings, maybe a stock market crashes, loss could be loss of a relationship, a loud one may pass away, relationship may break down, losses can happen. Now there are three ways we can process loss.

I have lost. This is the most objective, the Bhagavata calls this as the Sattvic way of processing. In Sattva, this was the opportunity, I lost it. I have lost. But if we are in rajas, it might become much more I am lost.

Now I am lost is far more disorienting. I don’t know what to do. Sometimes somebody has invested a lot of time and energy in a particular career and then maybe somebody wants to become an athlete and they get a career ending injury. I don’t know what to do in my life. I’m lost.

This is far more damaging. But the most damaging is I am a loser. Now when somebody starts interpreting it like that, that can be devastating and this is Tamas, this is the mode of ignorance. So if we start interpreting it like that, suppose we were in a relationship with someone who we thought was a loser, then what would we do? We want to end that relationship as quickly as possible.

But if we thought that we ourselves are losers, then what are we going to do? Can we end our relationship with ourselves? Can we break up with ourselves? Well we can’t but many times suicide is like a desperate attempt to try to break up with ourselves. So tolerance is a great virtue that enables us to keep small things small.

Somebody said this is not a small thing, this is a terrible thing. Yeah it’s terrible but it will pass, don’t overreact to it, don’t let reversible emotions lead us to irreversible decisions. So tolerance is a great virtue, it’s a very important power and each one of us we need this power because we live in a world which is very very volatile and we live with minds which are even more volatile. It’s a deadly combination. So tolerance is very much a virtue.

At the same time, what is it that we have to tolerate that we have to understand with wisdom. And then I was talking about the WIT, I is influence. Okay, I may decide that this is a big thing for me and this is a small thing for me. So now once I decide something is big and something is small, then I have to check. I wanna work on this big thing, but do I have the power right now to work on that big thing?

Or if you don’t have that power, what do we do? We have to work each one of us has a certain level of influence in our lives and we need to work with the influence that we have. So I’ll explain what this means that some of you may notice that I need crutches for walking. So when I was one, I got polio. That I my mother took me to a we used polio to a physician.

We were staying in a small town in Maharashtra in India. And she took me to a physician to get a polio vaccine. And unknown to that physician, because it is a small town, that clinic had had a power outage the previous night. And the fridge in which the clinic had been kept, the clinic had kept the vaccines had got disconnected from power. So the temperature had increased.

And the attendant didn’t notice that, neither the finished physician noticed that. So they gave me that vaccine, but because the temperature had increased, the germ percentage had increased within it. And the vaccine, instead of preventing polio, ended up causing polio. So now I don’t remember any of that, but I was about one and I was just learning to walk and I fell down and I could not walk afterwards normally. So and this happened, I had a maternal uncle here in America.

And he was among the first in our family, extended family, who had come to America. And when he heard this, he immediately said, you should you should sue the doctor. Now, my father is among the calmest persons I have known. His favorite verse in the Bhagavad Gita is of the section on Stitha Pragya, bistoik. So he told my uncle, my maternal uncle, he said that the Indian legal system is such that if you see sue them in court, probably we’ll die before the case comes for hearing.

Anyway, the thing has happened, what can we do about it now? So he accepted that. Now a few years ago, I was talking with a friend of mine, and he told me that this happened in America, in Florida. He said he he he was expecting a, a daughter, his wife was expecting, and, there was some complications, so she was rushed to the NICU and then they had a baby that was somewhat premature. But in the whole process, the the the medical staff did some multiple mess ups.

And because of that, when the baby was born, she had cerebral palsy and number of other issues. And now, then this devotee, he wrote to his spiritual master, spiritual master is also my spiritual master, Radhanath Maharaj, and he asked Radhanath Maharaj that should I accept this? This has happened, we’ve got a baby like this. Should I accept this as my karma or should I sue the hospital for it? It was their negligence.

So basically Maharaj replied to him saying that, it is what has happened, it has already happened, it is you have to accept the responsibility to take care of your daughter now. At the same time, it is your when it is your dharma to take care of your daughter, if you can get some support, some assistance in doing that dharma, in doing your duty, then you should seek that assistance. So he he sued the hospital and because it was a clear case, not a medical malpractice but medical negligence. So the hospital settled out of court and he’s got a fairly decent financial support for the lifelong care of his daughter. Now that does not change the fact that she is tragically physically damaged, but the fact is that it is not that tolerance means that something bad has happened, it’s my own karma accepted.

No, it is that we have to see what influence do we have. The focus is not on why something happened. The focus is on the cure. The focus when we are trying to deal with any problem in life. The focus always has to be on not whether it is karma.

Oh, is it my karma? Is it the baby’s karma? Is it this person’s karma? Our focus should not be on the cause. Whose karma is it?

Our focus needs to be on the cure and the cure is what is my dharma in this situation? What is my duty in this situation? And for the sake of my duty, I will do what is best for me. If we start focusing too much on karma, then where will we stop in that case, isn’t it? Say, if there’s a newborn baby, say, if say a guest comes to our home and the guest says we give them we have we have a guest room, say, and the guest says, oh, it’s so cold over here.

Can we tell them it’s your own karma that you are feeling cold? No. It is. What? If they have come to our home, it is our duty as hosts.

It’s our dharma to take care of our guests. So our focus should always be on our dharma, not on someone else’s karma. If we have a newborn baby and the baby is crying, and should the mother think, oh, the baby is crying because of her past karma? No. It is your present dharma to take care of the baby.

Now sometimes despite our best efforts to take care of the baby, sometimes there might be some disease that might take some time to heal. And that time the baby might be crying, we feel very bad, we see the baby is in pain. But then, if after doing our dharma according to our influence, according to our capacity, still if the problem remains, then we need to tolerate it. So our focus is not meant to be on the cause because we don’t know what whose karma is, what is known for us is what is our dharma. So we focus on our dharma and that way we see, okay this is my dharma, but how much influence do I have right now to do my dharma and we act accordingly.

So now what I understood, my my father when he was in India, the Indian legal system and the American legal system are quite different. I traveled all over the world, only in America have I seen ads of lawyers. Just as I was coming along, I saw, who hurt you? So, in each country, what what billboards are there, that does indicate something about the culture. I traveled all over the world.

Only in India have I seen jewelry ads. Huge ads of jewelry. It’s not generally for brides, but it’s for all occasions. So anyway, so America is a much more litigious country than India. And in India, my father didn’t have much influence.

So he took care of me and my parents, they I’ll talk about them a little bit forward, but we have to see what our influence is. It’s a big thing if a child is damaged in some way. But do we have the influence to choose to do something about it? If we don’t, then best to tolerate it and move on with life. If we have, then we should make a change to it.

So we look at our influence. And then the last part is what are the acronym once again? Wait. Wait. Yes.

Thank you. So now T is transform. Now transform can mean multiple things. Sometimes it can mean various kinds of transformation. So here once we have tolerated, so there is a very big difference between tolerate, to tolerate is not to suffocate.

Sometimes we are angry with someone, somebody is doing something, she’s annoying us, irritating us, and we keep burying all those feelings underneath us, and we keep tolerating. And then what happens is we keep tolerating tolerating tolerating but it’s all suffocated. And one day that person does something and we explode. And then when we explode what that person at that time has done might be very small but we explored for all the seventeen thirty six things that they had done before. And we didn’t do anything about that.

So tolerating is not about burying our feelings and living in a suffocated way. Tolerance is a much more resourceful way, like I said of choosing our battles. Which battle am I going to fight and which hurdle I’m not going to fight? So we need to transform something, either transform ourselves internally, transform ourselves externally. So this is where that way we transform is in three broad ways.

This is the concluding part. I use the acronym here for act. Sometimes we accept what has happened. So broadly speaking, what can we do? Say, if I am here and there is a big bully who is tormenting me.

Now what can I do? There are there is a person situation that is troubling me. So either I can just accept it, I can accept that it is there like that, or I can counter or I can transfer myself. Transfer myself means I go away from there. And all three options are perfectly valid.

The focus for a devotee like I said for others, how can I do my dharma? How can I serve Krishna in this situation? Ultimately, our dharma is to serve Krishna. So let’s take two sets of examples and I’ll conclude with that. See when the Pandavas came to the kingdom, they were born in the forest and their father unfortunately passed away and that’s when they were told by the sages, go back to the kingdom.

They told Kunti, you’re a single mother now and the forest is a dangerous place filled with deadly animals. You better go back to the kingdom. Little did those sages know that in the kingdom, in the palace was a far more dangerous animal in two legs on two legs. That was Duryodhana. So now when when they tried to poison Duryodhana tried to poison Bhima.

Bhima was Bhima somehow survived and he was enraged. He said, I’m going to trip this Duryodhana apart. I’m going to beat him to death. So at that time, Yudhishthir told him, you know, it’ll you don’t have any evidence that it was Bhima who did this. It’ll be your word against his word.

And we’re just new over here, we don’t know who in the family will support us, who will not support us, we don’t want to rip the family apart. Maybe he’s just a little insecure, maybe he could not Yudhishthir was a good reader of people. He noticed that Duryodhan had a lot of power. So but then when the Pandavas came, Bhima was much more powerful than Duryodhan. So naturally, Duryodhan might have felt a little insecure.

So Duryodhan Yudhish still wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. That is even people hurt us, there can be broadly say when some someone hurts us, there can be broadly two kinds of reasons, many, but broadly two kinds of reasons. The most positive explanation is that they are just insecure. They are not hurting us because they want to hurt us, but they’re just insecure. And if you pacify them that I’m not a threat to you, and they will support us.

The other is that they have envy or even enmity towards us. Maybe envy is in between. From envy, when it becomes active, it becomes enmity. So now, Yudhish still gave the benefit of the dog. He said, let’s accept it.

Let’s not do anything. But then what happened was, unfortunately, it did not work. What did they have to do? That they had actually, he started doing worse things. Initially, he had tried to poison Bhima, then he tried to kill the entire family including their mother also.

See, among all the ways in which you can kill an enemy, burning them is the most painful. Sometimes if there’s a big building on fire, people prefer to jump and die because in one moment it will be over. They’re burning, they’re burning for several minutes and a long time, it’s very painful. So he tried to do that. Now at that time, all the Pandavas said, okay, you know, let’s not confront them.

So they decided to remove themselves from the situation. They transferred themselves, okay? They stayed incognito for some time. Later on, when they got the kingdom, they also decided they they got half of the kingdom which is barren, they said let’s accept it and let’s live separately. So they transferred themselves away from the situation.

They moved to a different situation, let’s forget it. But then, Duryodhana was such that he kept persecuting them. He tried to dishonor their wife, then he after forty, thirty years of exile, he tried to dishonor their Krishna also. Then the Pandava decided, this person is never going to learn. So then if we are truly protectors, we are Kshatriyas, we need to protect not just our family, we need to protect society, protect humanity from this tyrant and therefore we have to fight.

So we need to fight against them. So basically there are different choices in different situations and in all of them the focus of the Pandavas was on how to serve Krishna. How can we best serve Krishna? If you look at Srila Prabhupada’s life, when Srila Prabhupada was in India, there’s a place called Jhansi, where Prabhupada has tried to start an organization. He called it the League of Devotees.

And this was between the first World or second World War at that time, there was a League of Nations that had been established. So Prabhupada had that grand vision that this would actually unify the whole world. So he started that and it was it seemed to be going well, but then suddenly there was a clique against him and the very property on which he was going to have his temple, that property was the deed to it was challenged. Now Prabhupada could have legally challenged that, fought the battle, but but Prabhupada decided to leave. He so again, if you look at this act what is act?

Remember, a is accept, c is counter. Counter. And t is? Transfer. Transfer means go somewhere else.

So when Shlupra was in Jhansi, what did he do? He transferred himself. Okay. Now why did Prabhupada transfer himself? He is reasoning, he tells in some of his talks afterwards, he said Jhansi was a small place, the people also were not so serious at that time, they’re more religious than spiritual, and they’re more ritualistic.

He said they’re not really interested in seeing seekers. So Prabhupada left for there. He said fighting this battle is not that big a thing. Now, when he came to America, he was staying, he was first staying in Butler, Pennsylvania. He was staying at the house of the Agarwal family who had sponsored his visit.

And they used to eat meat, even beef. And then would offer the proval of have his bhoga which he would cook for Krishna. He had to keep his bhoga in the same fridge. And now the hostess, she was was an Indian man who had married American women, just Gopal Agarwal and Salia Agarwal. So she she had some sensibility because her father-in-law would sometimes come to America, so she said that, Swamiji, I’m sorry, I have only one fridge over here.

And what does Prabhupada’s reply? Think nothing of it. Think nothing of it. Now, if in, say, five years down the line, ten years down the line, if in a temple, if something like that have been found, would Prabhupada say think nothing about it? Prabhupada would have said think nothing except about this.

How did this happen? Isn’t it? So at that time, Prabhupad in Butler, he accepted that. Why did he accept it? Because he knew he is not gonna permanently stay there.

These people are they are hosting him. They are not themselves. Prabhupada could make out very quickly that these people are they’re doing this as a courtesy for their father-in-law. They’re themselves not interested in becoming devotees. So Prabhupada is not interested in imposing his principle on people who are not interested.

So he said, okay. So the temple, they accept it. But then afterwards, when, around in the 1970s, when Prabhupada started working on a big project in India that was in Mumbai, in Juhu, Now there, there is a person who tried to, there’s a politician over there, he tried to take the money and not give the land. And when that happened, Srila Prabhupada, he wrote a letter to one of his supporters, he says, if he wants to steal Krishna’s land, he will have to go over my dead body. So Prabhupada fought over there, Prabhupada countered And why was that?

Prabhupada felt that Mumbai is a very important place, that Juhu is a prime property, we have already invested time, energy and money in the project. We want this for the service of Krishna. So Prabhupada was choosing his battles. So sometimes Prabhupada accepted, sometimes Prabhupada has transferred himself, Prabhupada sometimes countered. So in this way, tolerance is one virtue.

But the biggest virtue for a devotee is not tolerance, the biggest virtue is transcendence, being dedicated to the service of Krishna. And how do we serve Krishna? Sometimes we accept the situation we are in, sometimes we change the situation, sometimes we change ourselves and go to some other situation. Now most of the times, our tendency might be to fight, but that’s not very healthy. Sometimes our tendency might just go away from that situation.

But no. What is healthy is see, accepting, as I said, accept is not to suffocate. To counter is not to retaliate. It is counter means we are trying to fix the situation. We don’t hate the person.

The the person who was trying to take the money and the land from Srila Prabhupada, he passed away because of a heart attack. And then his wife tried to fight and she sent some hoodlums, some thugs to try to attack the devotes and intimidate the devotees. But then Prabhupada and the devotees were very courageous, they fought and finally she realized this is a battle I can’t win. She came to Prabhupada and then they signed the land deal properly and she says, Swamiji please forgive me for what what I did. And Prabhupada was completely saintly and ferocious, you are like my daughter, I’ll take care of you.

So countering is not retaliating. It is not that we we treat the other person as enemy and we have a vengeance. Countering is this is a wrong situation, I want to fix the situation. And transfer is not running away. Or in psychological terms, this is not that it is fight, flight, or freeze.

We’re not talking about any of these things. When we when we are talking about learning to tolerate, we’re not freezing, we’re not fighting, we’re not flight we’re not flighting, what we’re doing is we are focusing. We focus on what is the best way I can serve Krishna in this situation. And when we have that vision, that’s how we can move forward. So my parents, they didn’t just, okay, this is he’s got polio, we can’t do anything about it.

Now I what I remember when I was about two and a half or three, one of my relatives, distant relatives had come to meet us and she was consoling my mother saying that it’s so sad your son got polio. And I remember my mother’s voice very calm, clear, confident, She said, whatever he lacks physically, God will provide him intellectually. So, I don’t know why she said that, what ability she saw in me, but somehow that part stayed with me. And, yes, as I grew up, I couldn’t play outdoor games like other kids could play. And I part of me felt, you know, why why why is this happening to me?

This is unfair that I have this physical disability. But when I started studying, I noticed that, I could read rapidly, I could remember well, I could articulate clearly. And then somewhere in the back of my mind, it settled down that, okay, what did I do to deserve this intellectual ability either? Isn’t it? So life is unfair.

We all sometimes get things that we don’t deserve, but in the big picture, life is fairly unfair. Life is fairly unfair. Sometimes we get more than what we deserve and sometimes we get more than what we deserve. So the unfair part we want to tolerate, so that the fair part we can transform, we can tap that for the service of Krishna. So in this way tolerance can be very empowering for us.

I summarize what I discussed today, broadly speaking, mention three points that we’re talking about what is tolerance and how to tolerate, how basically the theme was how can tolerance be a power for us, how can tolerance give us strength and not be lead to importance, not make us weak? So I talked about three points. What are the first, what are the acronym? Weight. Weight, w I t.

W was? Wisdom. So wisdom is to know what are the big things and what are the small things. And the purpose of tolerance is to keep the big things big and the small things small. So tolerance is a great virtue because without tolerance, when life’s ups and downs happen, we will go way up and way down.

And what will happen is because of emotions that are often reversible, we will end up taking decisions. If there is no tolerance, then we’ll end up taking decisions that are irreversible. So that could be a disaster. And that’s why when something is going back, we’re going through a bad phase, tolerate it. It’s not going to last forever.

So it is meant to help us avoid irreversible decisions and that is a power. But we also need to recognize that it is not the big things that we should be tolerating against. So now if we decide, I is influence. Now what is it that we can do in a particular situation? So our focus should not be on whose karma is it.

Oh, this is this person’s karma, this is that person’s karma. Our focus should be on our dharma. What is my responsibility? What can I do in this situation to fix the situation? So when we are dharma focused, if we have the power to fight, we fight, if we have the power to we don’t have the power to fight, we accept, but then we fight in some other direction.

So the essence of tolerance is we all have to fight, but we need to choose our battles. So each of us in different situations will have different powers. So I give the example of, you know, my polio versus the cerebral palsy in America. This is the. In one case, they accepted, my father accepted.

In another case, you accept the response to find the situation because the we need to do our dharma and we do it in the best possible way. And last, he was transform. Now how do we transform? That means tolerance is not passivity. We can transform broadly.

You know, if there is somebody or some situation that is terrorizing us, they are persecuting us, then we have three options. We accept it, we counter it, or we transfer ourselves from that situation. So all three options can be done in a mood of service. So this is it is called the acronym act. Now the key difference for a devotee is how can I do my dharma?

How can I best serve in this situation? How can I serve Krishna in this situation? If we have that consideration, then we will decide what is the best thing to do. So transferring is not running away. Accepting is not suffocating.

It is not that we encountering is not retaliating. We are not focused on the situation, we’re focused on fixing the situation. So it is not fight or flight or freeze, it is focus on our service to Krishna. In this particular situation, how can I serve? So ultimately, when we chant the holy names, it is not just a utterance of a ritual, it is a prayer to Krishna, please engage me in your service.

So Krishna is actually guiding us that means, Krishna, please give me the intelligence to know which battles to fight. Krishna says I’ll give you the intelligence by which you can come to me. So let us pray to Krishna that He help us to choose our battles in the tolerance, helps us to keep small battles small and focus on serving Him in the best possible way in all situations according to our capacity whether it is by accepting, countering or transferring ourselves. So let’s repeat this prayer once, My dear Lord, can you repeat with me, My dear Lord, let tolerance increase my intelligence increase my intelligence not my importance. Thank you very much.

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Thank you very much for coming today. Today, I speak based on the Bhagavad Gita, and we talk about the principle of how God and God’s actions in this world when we say God protects. So how does Krishna protect? What does God protection mean and how does that protection work about? So many times if we look at scripture, we look at Shastra, there are two kinds of stories that are discovered.

There are some stories in scriptures. There are some stories which majority are those which are remembered are the stories of protection to say how Draupadi was protected by the Lord or how Arjuna was victorious in the crucial war. But then in the scriptures, there are also stories where there is devastation. Arjuna, although surrendering to Krishna and although being faithful and devoted still lost his son, Abhinav. So where what does Krishna’s protection mean?

And how does Krishna protect us? So I use three principles over here to explain that there is there is Prakruti, then there is Vikruti, and there is Sanskriti. So prakriti, vikruti, and Sanskriti. Prakrti means what does the word prakriti literally mean? Nature.

What does Sanskriti mean? Sanskriti is sanskar culture. And what is vikruti? So we have nature, we have culture, and we have culture. Well, yeah, so it’s perversity.

So the vulture sometimes it’s like a vulture culture is the word that some values. Vulture may go high up, but from there it just looks for corpses. It doesn’t look for any beautiful sight that can be seen from high up in the sky. It looks for where I can find it dead flesh so that I can eat it. So now when we use the word like in the Mahabharata there is a sentence that those who are followers of dharma will be protected by that.

The Bhagavad Gita is also a search for dharma. Arjuna is asking Krishna, Ruchami Tlam Dharma Sammoog Jethaha. So asking what is dharma? So now dharma has many different meanings. And I’ll focus on one meaning, and then we’ll see how other beings fall within that.

Dharma essentially means harmonious belonging. That whatever we belong to, we belong in a harmonious way. So in every situation, we will all will have some dharmon. For example, if say now we are having a spiritual talk so when we’re having this talk at that time my dharma the way I belong harmoniously if I am playing the role of a teacher is that I prepare the subject and I am ready to speak it properly and the dharma for those who are participating over here is that they come and join that they participate in a say you’re attentive you’re participating now if suddenly somebody’s phone starts ringing very loudly Then that’s an annoyance. Now if all of you are sitting together, now right now, now many of you may know each other, some of you may not know each other, but all of you are reasonably confident that the person sitting next to you is not going to suddenly turn upon you and slap you in the face.

Don’t look at the person next to you. Now is that possible? You could say anything is possible, but we understand that if somebody has come here for a spiritual talk they will have enough discipline enough awareness of situation and they will behave in a proper way. So whichever larger unit we belong to, there has to be harmony. So we need to belong in a harmonious way.

So for example, if you’re driving on the road, then we are being a part of the road transposes. Our dharma will be to follow the rules of the so we belong in a harmonious. So dharma in that sense has two components to it. There is individual and there is social. So individual Dharma means that I need to belong in a harmonious way and when I belong in a harmonious way, the society, the larger unit to which I am belonging should also reward me appropriately.

So there we follow the traffic rules, but then those who are overseeing the traffic rules should also be just. That means if somebody breaks the law, then they should pull them over, they should fine them, they should maybe take away their license, arrest them, but if somebody is not breaking the rules and still there is it, that will be a problem. Sometimes discrimination happens against certain groups of people. So dharma is both individual and social. For harmonious belonging to be possible, there has to be the all the components the individual and the collective should work properly.

Now if we consider in the Bhagavad Gita itself both meanings of dharma are seen. In 2.7 Krishna is asked being asked by Arjuna, I want to know what is dharma. It’s interesting he is not just asking what is mama dharma? What is my dharma? That’s of course the implied question, but he is asking a more universal question.

What is dharma? What is the right thing to do? Now when Krishna later on speaks in the Bhagavad Gita in the fourth chapter in the famous verses which describe the avatar, So now when he says I come to establish dharma, what does that mean? Does it mean when Krishna comes everybody will follow dharma at that time? Well, no.

There will always be people who will misuse their freedom. But at least the social order is made in such a way that those who are just those who are virtuous are rewarded and those who are vicious are punished. So, when Krishna comes to establish Dharma, that’s at a collective level. Now, even Krishna does not force Duryodhana to become dharmic. He persuades and doesn’t listen.

So dharma has a voluntary aspect. If the police cannot force people to follow the traffic rules. They don’t follow the traffic rules, there’ll be consequences. So there are in general, in life there are choices and there are consequences. Now, normally speaking if there is Dharma in society, if there is virtue in Buddhist society then positive choices will lead to positive consequences.

If somebody is helpful, kind and then they will be appreciated, they will be praised. If somebody is mean, somebody is cruel, they’ll be criticized, they’ll be content. So negative actions will have negative consequences. But when there is Adharma in society, what do you think happens? What do you think happens?

Positive actions lead to negative consequences. Somebody who is kind and helpful, that person gets exploited. That person gets abused, mistreated, taken for a ride. On the other hand, if there’s negative, then what happens? There are positive results of that.

Somebody, for example, is mean and cruel and exploitative, they say, you know, it’s clever. That’s not clever. That’s terrible. Isn’t it? So sometimes, you know, if we all know there are certain destructive habits, if taking drinking alcohol.

You see, in the western world, the general idea is that drink but don’t become drunk. That’s the idea. In fact there was a western thinker, European thinker who said taste of wine is the proof that God loves us. If God did not exist and God did not love us, how could something as tasty as wine exist? There are so many tasty things in the world.

Why fix it on that? But the point is that normally if a person is disciplined, regulated, if somebody says, you know, oh, I don’t drink, then, yeah, you’re a disciplined person. You’re a good person. Regulated person. That’s how society should be.

But if somebody doesn’t drink and say in college sometimes kids tease each other, you know, you are just, baby drinking your mother’s milk. When will you grow up? As if growing up means, drinking alcohol. So when somebody is doing something good and they are mocked for it, they are ridiculed for it. That is one sign of other.

Similarly, if somebody does sometimes people have drinking competitions. Now who can drink more? And if you drink more and more and still you act as if you are sober. Wow. Drink doesn’t affect you at all.

So that’s drinking you’re taking poison into your body. So Adharma is not just some religious morality given by somebody and if you don’t follow that, that’s Adharma. Yes. Religious morality is there, but Dharma is a universal principle of existence that we all need to belong to whatever unit we are a part of. And we need to belong in the proper way.

And if we belong in the proper way, then we should be rewarded for that. So, that is the principle of that. So, now if we look at this, Dharma means harmonious belonging. Now, let’s go back to three terms I use Prakriti, Sanskriti and Vikriti. Now what is Prakriti?

Now each of these levels have dharma. In Prakriti, the dharma. Dharma means the harmonious way of belonging. His mind is right. This is the rule of nature.

The rule of nature is survival of the fittest. Now, of course, it is true even the fittest don’t survive. Everybody dies eventually. However, what Darmaine talked about is not entirely wrong. It’s and it’s not what he talked about.

It’s a basic fact of nature that in nature, might is right. So in nature, if a deer can’t run as fast as a tiger kissing it, what will happen? The deer will die. Now the deer may say, you know, I’m harmless. I’ve never hurt anyone.

Yeah. It doesn’t matter. That this is the mind, relevant bite is speed. Now if the tiger or the lion doesn’t run fast enough. The deer speaks, You dear, how dare you run away from me?

I am the king of the forest. You are the king but I want to run away. Krishna says nuganam rugesh broham. Among animals I am the king. He talks about lion.

But still doesn’t matter. In nature the rule is might is right. So whoever has strength, that person wins. In the there is a saying jiske lathi, buske beis. So the idea is this is a basic rule of nature.

So prakriti that’s why we said there’s a law of the jungle and especially now if in a society law and order breaks down. If say the the police stop function. If in a society the criminals take charge then what happens? There’s a law of the jungle. Then there are criminals in charge in society.

They will not care who is who is law abiding, who is law breaking, all that they will say is who has well, let’s steal the intro. So so basically society in can also degenerate to the level of animal world. That is human society can also become existing at the level of the jungle. At the level of the jungle, it is might is right. So this is prakriti.

In prakriti, the dharma is might is right. As in the language of our old friend, it’s survival of the fittest. So now interestingly there is sanskriti. Sanskriti means culture. Now sometimes you say Sanskriti means wearing a particular kind of clothes, eating a particular kind of food, putting particular kind of markings on our head.

These are all parts of Sanskriti but they are not the essence. The essence of Sanskriti is that the Dharma here changes. Dharma means the harmonious way of belonging is here might plus virtue is right. Mind plus virtue is right. Now, it’s interesting that here also might is important.

See, Sanskriti is built on Prakriti. Sanskriti does not reject Prakruti. So, what does it mean? Here, it is not survival of the fittest, it is often sacrifice by the fittest. Sanskriti means sacrifice by the fittest.

So, what does sacrifice by the fittest mean? That it means that if say there’s a fire, in Los Angeles, there’s a horrible fire month or a couple of months ago, devastating loss happened. Now at that time, there are trained firefighters and they are expected to be fitter than everyone else and then they could say that, you know, there’s fire happening in their home. Let me go. No.

They are fit. They’re expected to run into the fire and save those who are and save those who are in danger. So, in Sanskriti, we don’t leave it to survival of the fittest, if you are unfit you die. Even if you are unfit, the fit will come to help. In Sanskriti means say, if a person is blind, he is trying to cross the road.

It is not that people with eyes push that person, get out of the harbor. Sanskriti means those who have eyes will help that person. It is maybe they’ll be in a hurry, but no. Okay. This person is not as fit as I am.

Let me help this person. So now still the law of nature is still there. What is the law of nature? That the stronger people will be stronger. The stronger people might will still be right.

If a person is very weak and that person goes into a burning fire to save someone else, that person will not be able to lift anyone. That person will not even walk out themselves. If a person can’t swim and the person says I will save someone who is drowning. They will not save someone who is drowning. Somebody will have to save save them when they start drawing.

So might remains the defining reality in the world. The might can be different kinds of might. It can be it can be physical strength. It can be skill. It can be intellectual power.

So for example, if terrorists have AK 40 sevens and the police have simple pistols. Now what is going to happen? Who is going to win? The terrorists are going to win. So might is still going to be right.

Nobody can change that principle in life. Might is right. Even the Pandavas in the Mahabharata as long as they didn’t have power they suffered. When they didn’t have power Bhima was poisoned. When they didn’t have power then they were attempted to be born alive.

It was eventually when they married Draupadi when an alliance was formed with another powerful king And that’s when Dhritarashtra had to take their claim for kingship seriously. And even then Dhritarashtra tried to whistle away out by giving them a barren half of the hill. But the point is that might is right is a fundamental principle of existence. But cultured society will be where there is sanskriti. It is not just might is right.

It is might plus virtue. That is why Krishna says two things indicating the seventh chapter and the tenth eleventh verse he is talking about. And he also says that Balam balavatam cha kam raaga vivarjita. So, Bala will be there everywhere, but that Bala is to be recommended which is not driven by selfish desire. Kam raaga vivarchita.

So, Sanskriti is where might plus virtue is right where those who are virtuous are protected by those who are might. Where the strength is used in the service of Marjana. Now as contrasted with this so there is prakriti and there is Sanskrit. Now if we had survival of the fittest as the rule in human society, it is partly a rule in human society. No doubt.

But it cannot entirely be the governing principle. In a family, say if one child is not very intelligent, maybe the child is not very competent. Then what happens? Other family members take care of that child. We say that cannot be cannot take care lifelong and each each person has to learn to be responsible.

But the idea is that in any group of people where there’s a sense of community, if one person is in trouble, we don’t say that’s oh you are unfit. Yes. It’s your problem. No. Others come to me.

That is Sanskritly. So, now as contrasted with this, there is Vikranti. Now in Vikranti what happens? Might plus wise is right. When there is difficulty in society, might and strength is used for the innate protection and perpetuation of vice for selfishness, for anger, for greed, for lust.

So, that is Vikrant. So, when Krishna said dharma a viruddho hute shu kamosmi vraddarsha. This is kama that is that can mean desire in general and it can be sexual desire in particular. Now kama needs to be in the pursuit of that. Karma should be engaged in in a way that a person can belong harmonious.

Belong harmoniously means what? Right? Karma is directed within the institution of marriage. But when that is not there? Vikruti is that a person who has who has lust, that person gains might and that person that person does anything in empathic.

Now that might could be physical power by which they overpower others. That might could be charming words that they speak that might could be the looks that they have by which they seduce others, renewed others. So, Ravana’s abduction of Sita that is Vikruti where might plus vice becomes right. Now when there is Vikruti in society then the vicious are rewarded. Like I said here what happens is dharma is when we do positive we get positive and we do negative we get negative.

Adharma is when we do positive and get negative. We do negative and we get positive. So this is the situation of Adharma. And this Adharma is where Vikruti becomes dominant. So now in every society we consider that Prakruti is the default reality and from Prakruti, we can rise to Samskruti or we can go down to Vikruti.

Now, this is a so so site choice for society, but this is a choice for every individual and at every moment sometimes it’s in a big way sometimes it’s a small way say no we are hungry And say, there are gulab jamuns. There’s there are 10 guests, and there are 10 gulab jamuns. Now we all want to enjoy good food. So for kruti means I’m hungry, I want to eat. Sanskriti would mean, okay.

Even if I get first to the fridge, I can’t eat all the gulagins. I should divide it. Vikruti means that I gobble down as much as I can and I hide the remaining and say, oh, there’s no gulagas today. So that would be Vikruti. So basically, for us at each moment, each moment there is a choice.

For example, the words we speak. Sometimes if we have power, we can dominate others and we can force them to do what we want them to do. Now that we that having that power that authority that is that is prakriti but we could use it to educate others. Okay. This is the right thing to do.

Therefore, you should do it or we could use it to exploit others. If you don’t do this, I’ll destroy you. So this choice between from prakriti to sanskriti or vekrti. That is a choice we have to make at every moment. Now Dharma as I said Dharma means harmonious belonging.

I’ll make two more points and then we’ll open for question answers that and each of these points will take one and a half hours each. So the Dharma as I said it means harmonious belonging. So each one of us belongs to many units. So for example we belong to a family. From a family we get something and we are expected to kill somebody.

So similarly we may be working in a company. We work in an office. So when we belong in the office we get salary from the office and we are expected to do work as the way to belong to our movies. We belong to a community. We belong to a country.

So each of us belong to many larger units and thus we have many different dharmas. For each unit that we belong to we have a dharma over there. So if we are in driving in America we drive on one side of the room. If we go to India we drive on another side of the room. The specifics of Dharma may have any but we are meant to belong to whichever whole we belong in a harmonious way.

And like this if we consider there are larger and larger wholes and then the largest whole is God is Krishna. So, when Krishna says, so, he is not telling that you give up Dharma. The emphasis is take up the So say if we are working in a company and sometimes if you are working in software company, you might be a part of we might be a part of two teams. In one team, we are expected to do one thing, another team we are expected to do another thing. And now if both team leaders want us to work at the same time, what do we do at that?

That is a Dharma Samgata. So we are belonging to two holes and two holes are pulling us into different directions. If say there is a deadline in our workplace and we have to be there in office at the same time maybe our child has got into trouble in school and we are as parents have come into the school in which I have met with the accident or child has got in some kind of trouble. Now okay should I go to school or should I stay at work? That is Dharma Samkut.

When there are two dharmas pulling us in two different directions so which hole do I belong to? That is something which has to be decided and we all need to be able to decide that care And this can be a tension this can be a cause of tension. For those of us say who have come from India to America then for us our identity still we are Indians. Although we are born in America, we live in America, we may have American citizenship. I have seen that Indians, they live for thirty years in America, but they are much more interested in Indian politics than they are in American politics.

Now American politics affecting them, so they are more alert to it. But we all have a certain sense of belonging. Now children, if they are born here, then what happens is they have two dharmas. As well as children who are born in America, they are like coconuts. What do you call coconuts?

They are they are brown from outside but white from inside. So what happens is that when the skin is brown, so you could say genetically or genealogically or ethnically they’re Indian. But psychologically, culturally often they think like Americans. So then what do you do? You know which identity do we highlight?

That becomes the conflict. It’s a Dharma Sankat. There’s a term called ABCD. Have any of you heard of this? Yes, American born confused they cease.

Some people are confused. That’s a Dharmasankat. What do we do? In today’s world for example, women face this competing dharmas especially. See, one of the big emphasis of feminism is, oh women should have a career and it’s fine.

It’s like women having a job is nothing against traditional culture. The in the gopis used to sell butter. There’s a fruit vendor over there in Krishna Lila also. But there’s one dharma is okay I want to have a job, I want to have a career, I want to have my own identity. Now other dharma is, I want to be a mother, I want to take care of my children.

Now these two dharmas, sometimes they pull us in different directions. Now which dharma is important? What is happening is that while both dharmas may be important biologically there’s a choice is do I want to be something to someone or do I want to be everything for some? You know, like, if somebody just goes into a career, okay, you become a software engineer, you become this, you become that. No.

We become like an interchangeable or replaceable unit in a large associate. Nothing bad about that. But for a month, for a child, the mother is not interchangeable or replace. To some extent that we can apply the same thing to the father also, but specifically nature has arranged that the mother is the primary caregiver, not just biologically, but even psychologically. Mothers are much more attuned to be able to take care of children.

So now what happens is two dharmas may pull us into different directions. So which dharma do we decide to belong to more? In the West, it has happened that more and more women choose career and then often the propaganda comes that marriage and motherhood are like traps. And then the result of that is they by the time they were 35, 40 or some 45 income, they feel very lonely and empty and they’re like, what am I doing? What do I have in my life?

And it’s another big problem is sociologically population is decreasing in the Western. The population will decrease enormously unless if there had been no immigration. Only immigration that is keeping the population balanced to some extent. Immigrants generally bear bear more children than the than the what they call the Vast, right? Anglo Saxon protesters, Americans, Caucasians.

So in many of the big cities in America among the white population, the number of pets is more than number of children. So what happens is that the need to nurture is there and we don’t have a need to nurture, we don’t address the need to nurture by taking care of a baby when we get a pet. I was at the Govardhan Eco Village and it’s a place in India where there’s a lot of spiritual opportunity and atmosphere for for people for anywhere but especially for westerns. And lot of yoga teachers come over there. They come to learn yoga, the yoga students come, their teachers come to learn to further deepen their practice, they bring their students.

So I met one person over there, I said, yes, I asked him what do you do? American person, he said I am a yoga teacher. And what? Yoga? He said, no, dog teacher.

Says, what is dog? Doga is yoga with dogs. I want to do everything with my dog so actually if you see Google there are pictures like you know the person will be doing yoga stretching and the dog will be searching its paws and the person that shifts us and I don’t know how dog will do shifts us but whatever so there is dooga and then there is koga what is koga Yeah, cats. So basically the need to nurture is there and that is now missed there is elected elsewhere. So but the point is it’s attention is the concept of dharma and dharma samovar different dharmas pulling us in different directions.

That is something which is universe. Universe, we cannot avoid that. So when I was in, when I think I started coming to America for twenty fourteen. So 2015, I came by the coast of actually. 2060, ’20 ’70.

So I was once in Texas. I was giving a class, and after in that class, an American girl asked a question, why don’t religions fight among each other? And I gave an elaborate answer. And I could say I talked about three more. They talked about extremism and everything.

She was quite satisfied with the answer I could see. Then after the class, I was talking with people, and then she came forward and said this question had been burdening me for a long time. You have relieved me. I’m so grateful. Can I give you a hug?

Now I’ve been told that this possibility is there. And in the western culture, hugging is just a normal expression of affection. That doesn’t seem like that for us and certainly as a Brahmachari. So now what happened for me that as a Brahmachari obviously I have to say no. But as a teacher of Bhagwadida, as a preacher, I should not discourage it.

So I had talked with my spiritual guides and they said that for them, that’s an expression of their appreciation and attention. We cannot reject that. So then I just look at the devotee was with the host over there, organizing the provost. I figured, please help me. So he helped me, but in the most unexpected way.

He said, he’s a monk. On his behalf, you can hug me. And his wife was next to him. When the wife said, I’m his wife on his behalf. So I told this incident to my spiritual master, Raghav, but he was laughing and he said that.

No. We cannot accept the expression of affection, but we cannot reject the affection that has been offered. So we have to find a sensitive way in which to deal in such situations. So the point is that we all have multiple identities, multiple roles, multiple dharmas we have and often there will be a tension between them. So when Krishna says Sarva dharman parit jama mekam sharanam raja what does he mean?

He means that when two dharmas are pulling us into different directions, should we do this or should we do that? Let us focus on Krishna and let us think of how best can we serve Krishna in this situation. So ma ekam sharanam ji. For Arjuna, the two dharmas that were pulling him in two different directions were at that time Arjuna was a Kshatriya and Arjuna was a Kuru Nandena, he was a Kuru Mancha leader. So as a Kshatriya as a Kshatriya dharma was fight.

Anybody who is a aggressor, anybody who is a aggressor, that person needs to be killed. But now he was not just he had a he belonged to the Guru Amisha he was a Guru leader. He was a Guru. He had a Kula Dharma. Kuladharma is if we are belonging to a particular community, a particular race, a particular dynasty, a particular family, we are going to protect the Hinduism.

So Kshatriya dharma told him fight. And Kuladharma told him, both fight. So does he had a what do I do in such situations? So now what does Krishna tell over here? That if two dharmas are pulling us in opposite directions instead of looking here and looking there and getting confused look upward look upward to see ultimately I belong to Krishna.

I’m a part of Krishna and in this particular situation, how can I best search? How can I best search? So there Krishna wanted that Dharma we established in society and for that purpose Arjuna needed to fight. So when Arjuna says I will fight, how did he fight? He is not saying I look I am Kshatriya and therefore I am fighting.

He says Krishna, I will do your will and if your will means fighting, I will fight. So going back to the earlier example I gave that somebody is working in the company and they have two team leads. They belong to two teams and each team lead wants them to do the same something at the same time. What can they do? I suppose that they have access to the CEO and the CEO they write into there is two projects whatsoever the CEO says you know okay you work on this project but what about the other team that team need to get get angry with me I’ll take care of him.

I’ll deal with him. So the idea is that Krishna is not telling Arjuna to give up Dharma. Krishna is telling Arjuna to have a higher vision of a bigger belonging, a bigger belonging. For example, in the Mahabharata said that for the larger whole, sometimes the smaller whole is being supervised For the sake of the family, one member will sometimes be sacrificed. For the sake of a village, one family will be sacrificed.

For the sake of a country, one village will be sacrificed. Now, of course, ultimately, it says for the sake of the soul, the whole world can be sacrificed. But the idea is that there is higher dharma and dual dharma, and the highest dharma is our dharma for Krishna, belonging to Krishna. Having said this, so what are we discussing over here that how does Dharma work in this world? So sometimes there will be tension between Dharma.

Dharma basically is might is right. So, but might with virtue is right that will be sanskriti. That is the kind of dharma we want in society. Not that the law of the jungle. So, now that brings us to the last call Janik that when Arjuna won the Kurukshetra war did he will because of the knowledge of the Bhagavad Gita or because of the knowledge of archery that he had learnt throughout his life?

What do you think? Both. Sorry? Both. Both.

Yes. Now both. Why both? Because the knowledge of the Bhagavad Gita gave him a purpose. Okay, what am I meant to do?

And the knowledge of Archery gave him the tools. So we need the purpose. What what am I meant to do? Why am I meant to do it? And then we need tools for it.

So if Arjuna had not been that great in Archer, he could have fallen to the fox. Karna could have killed him. Dhruva Pratyakshmi. So Abhimanyu was not that great messenger. Of course the opponents resorted to Adharma.

They fixed up the attacker but eventually he was killed. So in this world for us if we want to do some service, so I’ll close with one diagram. This is epitomized by Hanuman. It is actually also Hanuman like Arjuna, he’s a great devotee, he’s also great warrior. So Hanuman’s folded hands, they signify bhakti.

Now bhakti in one sense is the ultimate dharma. We want to belong to Krishna. So that is dharma taken to his ultimate. Hanuman, the mace that he hands is in his hands that signifies Shraddi. So for us to succeed in life, we need Shakti and we need Rakti.

We consider four quadrant diagram. We need Shakti and we need Rakti When both are there then there will be success. Now suppose somebody is asked to cook for a festival and they have bhakti. They cook in a very devotional prayerful mood, they have they have nice picture of deities, the kirtan is going on, they also pray to Krishna, they will start cooking but they just don’t know So they have bhakti, but they don’t have shakti. When they cook, Krishna will be pleased by their cooking, and only Krishna will be pleased.

Isn’t it? So bhakti without shakti, there will be spiritual but there’ll be material failure. There is spiritual success but at a material level, there will be success. So if you want to be successful in the material world, we need to acquire the required shunt, whichever field that might be. If somebody wants to lead a kirtan, they may have a great devotional heart, but if they don’t know how to sing, they may sing off off tune, and Krishna will be pleased with the singing, but you know others will not be.

So the idea is that if there is no bhakti and no shakti, you know that there’s only failure, material and spiritual failure. Now if there is Shakti but no Bhakti then what will happen? Like industrial success. Shakti there’ll be material success but there will be spiritual in it. So now what we want is both bhakti and shakti in our life.

So through our practice of, the sadhana we do our chanting, we do kampasat samura, we all try to increase bhakti. But by all this we can also develop our shakti. Sometimes we have particular Shaktis already. We can use them in Krishna. Sometimes the practice of bhakti uses clarity.

K. These are the gifts that I have been given. These are the gifts that I can use. And then we can use those in Krishna’s sense. So if you see Arjuna Shakti was different from Bhima Shakti.

Bhima had great physical prowess and Arjuna did not have. Now Yudhishthira Shakti was different from Yudhishthira Shakti. If you consider the perspective of character, you cannot think of two brothers who are as different as Yudhishthira and Bhima. Yudhishthira was a Kshatriya, but he was almost like a Brahminical Kshatriya. That bend backwards and but try to avoid conflict.

Bhima was a Kshatriya Kshatriya He was not like Duryodhana. He was not out to abuse his power for selfish purposes. But still he was different. So the point is that we all will have different kinds of Shakti. And when Krishna says Maa Anusmarat Yudhye Chah.

Maa Anusmar is our bhakti. Yudhye Chah is with our particular skills, with our particular strengths we fight in this world for whatever service we are called upon to whatever dharma we are called upon to do. And when we do both that’s when we’ll be successful. Srila Prabhupada’s life if we consider he had always great Bhakti who read his writings written in 1940s the way back to God that he published over there. He is filled with profound realization.

However, at that time he did not have any followers. He did not have any references. His message did not go very far. The message was potent. When he came to America, he got followers.

When he had that shakti, then Shakti I am talking into the material manifestation of the Shakti. When that happened the Prichy ex now this is expanded. So this is the principle each one of us when we want to serve Krishna, we want bhakti and we also want Shakti. Shakti means whatever particular service we want to do we need to have the appropriate skill set for that sense. And when Srila Prabhupada asked how will the Krishna conscious movement spread?

He said it will be by organizational intelligence. One of the questions he was asked towards the end of his life. Now he did not say you should wake up and attend mughalati every day. He did not say that you should charge him to stay in a hotel. Of course, all those things are important.

But if the Krishna conscious movement is to spread in the material world, we need the appropriate material skills. We need the appropriate material skills. What is material skills? We need to plan properly, we need to follow-up properly, we need to organize properly. So if we are not doing that then we won’t reach.

One of my friends, he has now become a devotee. He he told me that when he was searching for his path, he wrote he wanted to this was before the Internet 02/2007, ‘2 thousand and ‘8. Internet and email had not become that big. So he said they were there. He said he wrote through 25 temples, big temples in India.

He does an email, send physical mail asking what what you know I want to learn more about Hinduism. I want to learn more about Bhagavad. I want to learn more about Dharma. Can you teach tell me some things? Said I wrote to 25 temples and I wrote to 25 churches.

And among the 25 temples, not even one temple was put. Not all of them were called temples. You know the way these temples. Among the 25 churches, there was not even one church that did not respond. He said all of them responded within one week, ten days.

He said five of them, they send me free Bibles. And two of them actually send a representative to give a Bible to me at my home. So now in this world, might is right. Those who market themselves better will reach better even if there’s some substance is not not that great. So might is right will always be a truth.

Now it is this is not to criticize Christianity as adharma. I’m just talking about a principle over here that those who are competent, those who are at a material level having the appropriate skills and working appropriately, they will reach more people. That’s just a fact of life. So when the war started, when the Islamic rulers were attacking India, Indian Kings would fight on elephants and the Muslim kings would come on chariots. Now the elephant has a certain level of majesty but just because you are so high up makes you also vulnerable.

So if one Muslim king would shoot one arrow and a king is killed, the whole army would collapse. Shivaji Maharaj changed the complete dynamic. If you see Shivaji Maharaj, the famous king in Maharashtra, you will not see a single image of him on a chariot. He is always on horseback. The Muslims would come on chariots.

Now horses without chariots run much faster. So he was outnumbered. The strategy he used was sudden attacks. Guerrilla warfare. As nowadays they call it asymmetric warfare.

So it was Asymmetric. He just did not have the forces. So what did he do? He used the Shakti of speed. So the Shakti we all whatever battles we need to fight we need to acquire the right Shakti.

To the extent we acquire the right shakti, to that extent we will be success. So shakti and bhakti are both required. At the end of the Bhagavita, Krishna says Yatra Yogeshwara Krishna, Sanjay says actually. Where there is Krishna and where there is Arjuna? There there will be victory.

So there there will be glory. There there will be happiness. So in this way Krishna and Gita calls all of us to actually grow in our lives in both Shakti and bhakti. Well, someone writes what I discussed today. I talked about the Gita’s teachings three principles how we can apply them in our life.

So I talked about first is that there are three terms. The first is prakriti. I the first the first part is I basically introduced terms. Prakriti means might is right. Now on that basic truth, we can move in two directions.

Sanskriti means what? Anyone remember? Yes. Might will always be right, but it is might plus virtue. So it’s Sanskriti is the rule of the jungle.

In the jungle, if an animal animal becomes weak, animal becomes, become develops, becomes lame or blind, They just fall prey. It will just be devoured by others. But in human society, if somebody is weak, it is not sacrificing, surviving of the fittest, it is sacrificing of the fittest. That is Sanskriti. As compared to that, Vikruti is what?

Might plus wise. Might plus wise is right. That means though might is right will always be a truth, but above that we can have various truths. And then I talk about Dharma means harmonious belonging. So Dharma has two aspects.

There’s individual aspect that I do my part properly. If I am driving, I follow the rules of traffic. And then there’s a social part. Social part is where that I do my part rightly, and I’m not pulled over because I belong to a particular community and I’m not just allowed to go scot free just because, I belong to a privileged community. So there’s individual dharma and the social dharma.

So individual dharma means we make right choices. We belong harmonious. And social dharma means that the right choices will lead to the right results, so the right consequences. So the positive will positive actions will give positive rewards. Now Adharma means the opposite.

Adharma means that those who do positive get negative and those who get do negative get positive. So now how might Adharma occur? Adharma may occur when there is Vikruti in suicide. When those in charge are not concerned about virtue, they become concerned about vice. So might becomes used in the service of vice.

Then I talk about Dharmasanphet or Dharmasanphet. We belong to we have because we belong to many different roles. We all may sometimes feel pulled by different roles. Like a parent may feel pulled. Should I continue working at home or should I go and take care of my child who is having some crisis?

So basically we all belong to multiple holes and we could say each one is larger than others and the largest one is is Krishna. So that is God. So when we feels that means one duty is pulling us in one direction and other duty is pulling us in the opposite direction. For women their maternal and professional roles may pull them in opposite directions. For a preacher culture may impen them to do one thing but compassion may require them to do another thing or sensitivity may require them to do another thing.

So we are pulling in different directions. So what is the solution? At such times we need to look upwards look upward towards Krishna and see how best can I serve Krishna in this situation and then act accordingly? And then lastly we discussed that we should resolve dharma properly and then we talked about the principle that samskrti has to be built on top of pranupati that we all we need to acquire the appropriate shakti in our life. We discussed this diagram that there is shakti.

Shakti is not just physical strength but skill that is required for service and that is good. This is the best situation where there is all around success, material and spiritual success already. So now he if we have Abdi Vadhu Shabdi, we’ll have spiritual success but not material success. Now if we have neither there’ll be no success at all and there can be material success if there’s shakti but there’ll be no spiritual success. So it is our responsibility to develop bhakti by sadhana but also feel responsibility if you want to do a service at bhakti then we also need to develop the right shakti.

So seva if you have a seva vow, if you have a service attitude, that means the Bhakti has not just devotion, but devotional service. So devotion is seva vow means we try to increase our bhakti, and we also try to increase the shakti which we can do our own. So if you want to build a temple for Krishna, bhakti that intention is good. We do nice kirtan, we do nice identity worship but we may also need to raise funds for that. And so Bhakti and Shakti when both come together that’s when we could actually practically transform the world.

And each one of us may have different Shaktis which you can use in Krishna’s Essence. Thank you very much. Are there any questions or comments? Yes. So you’re talking about the response, Kriti.

How would that be applied in a corporate culture? For example, this start helping somebody who does not have correct strength. That would also be leading to, ineffectiveness of the organization that you are spoon feeding somebody in higher that can be solved. How would you worry about this? Good question.

I need to go to get into politics. I understand. Yeah. So this basically this is the fundamental question of conflict between the political left and the political right. You know, what is the idea of the political right?

The right is all about the right are conservative. Those on the left are liberal. So what we can understand is those who are on the right are concerned with what is right in the existing structure. And those who don’t fit in that structure, that’s your problem. You exist.

You settle. So the right are concerned about they see how many things are working in society. Preserve that. Now the left are concerned with those who are missed out by the existing system. So the right and the left both have any concerns say for example if we have say consider credit in India now credit is immensely popular but say probably ten, fifteen, twenty years ago.

The cricket coaching academies and cricket talent scouts they’ll mostly be in the big cities. Mumbai has a disproportionate number of players being a part of the Indian cricket. Is it that Mumbai has more talented cricket players born in Mumbai than anyone else? That could be one possibility. Other possibility could be that that the the support is a supporting environment, is much more.

So now the the right will see, this is working. We are getting so many so many good candidates coming over. But the left will say, oh, good. All other part of the country is left out. We should have coaching and there also.

We should be. So now who is right? Sometimes the right is right, sometimes the left is left is right. What that means is sometimes we need to conscript that this is still and it’s working and we can’t just reject the system because some people don’t fit into it. But sometimes it may be that the left is right.

Okay? Not many people are left out of it or the people who are left out of the system. There’s a they they are suffer severely. So for example, now in in the case of right, they focus a lot on individual response. You know, you work hard.

You raise yourself up by your bootstraps. In the left, there’s a lot of emphasis on social justice, social change, systemic adjustments that so now which is required will interpense. It’s not that there’s one absolute answer. Sometimes so now in the case of your specific question, if people are incompetent, can they become competent? Maybe, maybe not.

So everybody needs a bit of a helping hand sometime or year and we should have an ethos when we offer children a helping hand. But it shouldn’t happen that somebody offers a helping hand and the other person expect that your hand should be there all the time for the rest of my life. Everybody then you can actually take a response. So in general competence is like Shakal. People need to have basic competence.

If people don’t have competence and people don’t have the commitment to develop the competence then helping them is really not helping. Like I think it was in Harvard there’s a big court case There’s an Indian boy. He wanted to get into medicine and he had nearly 3.94 perfect cGBA. He didn’t get it. He was in South India.

So he did some some kind of underhand things and then he brought some kind of genetic connection and he claimed that he is black and he got his meditations from all I believe universities. He actually he entered in and studied for one year and then he just dropped out and he is going to book out with experience so exposing the college. So basically Indian and Chinese students they sued Harvard because they found that now a student with maybe 2.9 c g p a from certain communities could get in and somebody with 3.9 c g p a wouldn’t get in now. So actually in many ways Indian universities are much more transparent about their admission quotas or admission systems. Now if you have what above this much percentage there’s a cut off.

So although the law will get admission, although the law will not get. But many of the big universities in America they don’t reveal their their priority rights. They’re very non transacting. So now America prided itself on being a meritocracy. But you know if say if merit is not there I have a devoted friend who works in in Harvard although the whole environment is a leftist and he said I cannot speak this public name.

He says that when through this diversity quota students come in they just can’t cope. Like some everybody in the class has a IK of 141 student has got IQ of one twenty. Then what happens is you can either you have to slow down everyone to fit that one person or that person’s still are they struggling to catch? And then that often these people just drop out and they feel very they feel I failed with my life. Instead of going to Ivy League College, they could have gone to a middle level college and they would have actually succeeded.

So the point is Shakti will always be required. Now sometimes support is needed. So this giving support cannot change the reality that competence will be required. So a person does not have a basic level of competence then just creating social change is not going to correct those changes. So that’s why the broad answer will be a support should be given but support should be given so that the person starts learning and growing and taking responsibilities.

The person either is not willing to do that or the person is just not able to do that. Then maybe the way support should be offered is give that person some other group or help them encourage them to find some other group. Just a follow-up, probably. So in society, it is different. In, organization, it is different.

Society, we may even the person is not able to raise him up for the competence, we may still help out. Yeah. But in organization, it’s not like that. It it it works everywhere also. Society also to what extent can you do it?

Many countries now especially which is that? There are some countries where the China is facing this problem, Japan is facing this problem. They will have a very large older population and the younger population is not there at all. So there is no very few people who are wealth creators and there are large number of people who are dependent on socials their version of social security or whatever. So So how much can society support image?

I think in Italy, in two countries, I think Italy and Poland, they have arranged that that actually, like, any couple who has more than two children, then the pope will personally baptize their child. There’s that much of a crisis over there. So they release they have they have financial incentives that the government provides some support But the thing is that society can support only up to a particular point. So I think the extent of support will differ from the particular organization that one is part. So especially if one is in a very competitive field.

Say, for example, if somebody in the military, if you don’t have competence, you will be killed. You will cause other people to die. So if somebody in some other field where it’s not so high stakes, then, you know, more support can be given. So I think it which which four you do not also make a difference. Yes, sir.

Okay. I understand. Hello, Krishna, Progy. You said, Progy, when we are in the two dharmas in opposite direction, We need to look up to the lord of Narsisha. Correct.

But in that situation, our mind will not go there. Our mind will go this two situations one. Correct. How can you talk? Well, you have to get frustrated looking in two directions.

So that is one way. The other is we have some devotees who guide us somebody who is looking upward and they help us look upward. See ultimately every one of us has to come to terms with the finiteness of the human condition. That means that we are all finite beings and we cannot do everything that we like. We cannot even do many things that we want to do.

So we have to make choices And the idea is that ultimately when we look up, it is not just in frustration. It will be a lot of frustration. But eventually, it is by the understanding that God has a part for me to play. But that does not mean I have to do the whole thing. Now I have a part to play and I meant to play my part as well as I But then when we surrender depend on Krishna that doesn’t mean you don’t play our part.

It means I will play my part but that doesn’t mean I have to control everything and to make everything else. So that’s why sometimes we have to decide that this if you connect with Krishna we may be able to understand the Dharmi Yogam from Krishna says that we will get a little bit of clarity of confidence that okay this is the part I should play right now I should prioritize right now. Other things will be taken care of afterwards okay I take care later Rokshana will take care things will work out so that understanding that I am a part of a team We say often this we use that as a shloka to beat bioethics. The philosophical implication is that the eternal parts of Krishna do not become one with Krishna. But its psychological implication is that if we are always parts of Krishna that means we will always have parts in Krishna’s plan.

Krishna will always have a part to play for us. Say somebody take a cricket team and now they will only if they are in the cricket team of India, they will have a part in the team. Now what is that part? Are there crit keepers, fast ballers, media pacers, spring baller, and attacking batsmanner, sheet time, middle order batsman, whatever. I think that will be but they have a part.

So we are always on team Krishna. We always have a part. Which part it may be that we’ll gain? Sometimes you may have to accept that this part I can no longer play. And I’ll focus on this part and then play this part.

So the last question before we start with thank you very much.

The post Why we need shakti along with bhakti, Sacramento – Chaitanya Charan appeared first on The Spiritual Scientist.

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